Bad News - Page 3

culcune · 12-08-2020, 08:25 PM

Try this VIN decoder from the NHSTA. I put in my TGB scooter VIN and it gives limited information. When I put in my VIN, the limited information was that it is a 'Motorcycle'. But it is listed as a 'Motorcycle' so perhaps at the DMV they can input your VIN themselves in front of you?

https://vpic.nhtsa.dot.gov/decoder

ChipToothy · 12-08-2020, 08:36 PM

Update: I was able to see a print off of the MCO and other paper work the state has. They also ran my Vin through the system. I am the only one in Arkansas with that bike lol, bad news it comes up as a for title purposes only dirt bike the same as those Tao Tao 150’s etc in which they found hundreds of. That part makes sense since I know literally were like five different dealerships for those things are.

After literally another hour of at the DMV making phone calls and talking they have decided that I can pay a professional mechanic for a modification inspection and to bring that paperwork to the DMV and they will retag it as a modified dirt bike. It’s gonna cost 50-100 bucks for the closest dealerships to me to do it but hey I’ll be back on the road at some point.

Heed my warning, before you pay make sure the bike isn’t listed as a “dirt bike”. Mine was fine with the state back in Spring 2018 up until this week.

duck9191 · 12-08-2020, 08:51 PM

So the dealer screwed up and listened it as something other than "motorcycle" on the mco and they screwed up and issued it a street legal title?

culcune · 12-08-2020, 10:38 PM

Out of curiosity, plug in your VIN into the decoder I linked above and see what pops up.

old_airhead · 12-09-2020, 09:02 AM

Just bought a Hawk DLX a few weeks back. The Bill of Sale that my state requires description field says "RPS 1 Dirt Bike". I was wondering if that was going to be an issue at the BMV, but things went relatively smoothly. The lady filling out the forms asked if it was a dirt bike. I told her no, it was a street legal dual purpose bike and that there was a DOT sticker on the bike (I don't even know if these exist!). So, it seems that part of the problem is that the seller/importer is not using the proper description on their paperwork - they should probably be made aware of that. My title and registration came a few days ago and both listed the type of vehicle as "MC", so I guess I'm in the clear for at least a year.

By the way, Progressive insured the bike as a street bike. They would not offer me full coverage, though, because they said the bike was a grey market vehicle, whatever that means. No big deal, I have maximum liability on it and figure a $2k motorcycle isn't really worth full coverage.

Good luck ChipToothy. Keep us posted.

old_airhead · 12-09-2020, 09:11 AM

Just tried culcune's VIN link and got this:

Error Text: 6 - Incomplete VIN; 10 - Off-road Vehicle Error – This is not a vehicle identification number (VIN) for a motor vehicle. This indicates that the manufacturer did not certify this product as complying with the Federal motor vehicle safety standards which are applicable to motor vehicles as defined at 49 U.S.C. 30102.

What? Did the manufacturer mess up?

TxTaoRider · 12-09-2020, 09:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old_airhead

Just bought a Hawk DLX a few weeks back. The Bill of Sale that my state requires description field says "RPS 1 Dirt Bike". I was wondering if that was going to be an issue at the BMV, but things went relatively smoothly. The lady filling out the forms asked if it was a dirt bike. I told her no, it was a street legal dual purpose bike and that there was a DOT sticker on the bike (I don't even know if these exist!). So, it seems that part of the problem is that the seller/importer is not using the proper description on their paperwork - they should probably be made aware of that. My title and registration came a few days ago and both listed the type of vehicle as "MC", so I guess I'm in the clear for at least a year.

By the way, Progressive insured the bike as a street bike. They would not offer me full coverage, though, because they said the bike was a grey market vehicle, whatever that means. No big deal, I have maximum liability on it and figure a $2k motorcycle isn't really worth full coverage.

Good luck ChipToothy. Keep us posted.

Lol- Progressive wouldn't let me put full coverage on mine either. Then asked if I had any non stock items or upgrades. I'm thinking, why ask if you're not gonna pay to replace it any way? Lol

goJimH · 12-09-2020, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Update: I was able to see a print off of the MCO and other paper work the state has. They also ran my Vin through the system. I am the only one in Arkansas with that bike lol, bad news it comes up as a for title purposes only dirt bike the same as those Tao Tao 150’s etc in which they found hundreds of. That part makes sense since I know literally were like five different dealerships for those things are.

After literally another hour of at the DMV making phone calls and talking they have decided that I can pay a professional mechanic for a modification inspection and to bring that paperwork to the DMV and they will retag it as a modified dirt bike. It’s gonna cost 50-100 bucks for the closest dealerships to me to do it but hey I’ll be back on the road at some point.

Heed my warning, before you pay make sure the bike isn’t listed as a “dirt bike”. Mine was fine with the state back in Spring 2018 up until this week.

While I regret your problems - I am glad to hear you have a path forward.

Best of Luck!

grumpyunk · 12-09-2020, 12:55 PM

goJimH:"Do you have a copy of the MCO?? Could it be - at original registration someone selected DB and at the time that was find and did not make a difference. I wonder if it is possible to assert that DB was incorrect and it is and was in fact a street legal motorcycle - and get the original title corrected?"

Maybe get back to the selling dealer and ask what records they have if you don't have a copy of the MCO. The dealer should maintain records of vehicles sold, though I don't have an idea of how far back. If they sold to others in the same state, you may be able to contact them to see if similar 'happenings' are occurring, and their possible solutions.
I have bought two bikes that were not real popular items within the last 6-9 months, and both times the titles got 'hung up' in the state system(GA), and it took a call to the local county DMV office to get them to actually print the title. Also, both bikes needed to have an inspection by the local Genarmes(at no cost, and they came to my home and were extremely pleasant) to insure it was the same machine as on the title.
GA law indicates I do not need said inspection, but "SOMEBODY" decided that an inspection, and a 'statement of fact' had to be made to discern a motorcycle from another type of vehicle. I had to attest to hp, speed, number of cylinders, and I don't know what all, but it had to be over 50cc or it was not 'titleable'.
Might be interesting to look at recent AR legal 'changes' that would cause such consternation about titling/licensing of off-road vehicles that they would send someone to confiscate an expired license plate. I have NEVER heard of any government group that wanted expired plates. I have multiple on my basement wall...
tom

culcune · 12-09-2020, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old_airhead

Just bought a Hawk DLX a few weeks back. The Bill of Sale that my state requires description field says "RPS 1 Dirt Bike". I was wondering if that was going to be an issue at the BMV, but things went relatively smoothly. The lady filling out the forms asked if it was a dirt bike. I told her no, it was a street legal dual purpose bike and that there was a DOT sticker on the bike (I don't even know if these exist!). So, it seems that part of the problem is that the seller/importer is not using the proper description on their paperwork - they should probably be made aware of that. My title and registration came a few days ago and both listed the type of vehicle as "MC", so I guess I'm in the clear for at least a year.

By the way, Progressive insured the bike as a street bike. They would not offer me full coverage, though, because they said the bike was a grey market vehicle, whatever that means. No big deal, I have maximum liability on it and figure a $2k motorcycle isn't really worth full coverage.

Good luck ChipToothy. Keep us posted.

I went to the EPA/DOT Excel spreadsheet and found the RPS Hawk DLX on it. I scrolled over to get a sample VIN number (that the manufacturer gives) which is LC4HCNL55J0000001. I plugged it into the VIN decoder and it seems to give contradicting information. Up top, it said something about it being a dirtbike. Down below, it stated 'On-Road dirt bike' As far as I know, being on the lengthy Excel spreadsheet means the bike was granted an EPA/DOT certiifcation for an 'On-Highway Motorcycle' considering it is on the list of bikes that are 'On-Highway Motorcycles'?! Does the sample VIN look like your bike's VIN? If not, perhaps yours is a 2020?

When I put in sample VIN for a 2018 Bashan (they have several models listed on the same certificate on the Excel sheet) LHJPCNBF6CB000002 and 2018 as the model year, it gave a clearer picture on the VIN Decoder that it is in fact a 'Motorcycle' and that was at the top part of it. Interesting differences!

discochris · 12-09-2020, 03:45 PM

Progressive would not give me full coverage either on the Bashan BSR250. Oh well.

I plugged my VIN into the decoder, and it does show as a standard motorcycle.

culcune · 12-09-2020, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by discochris

I plugged my VIN into the decoder, and it does show as a standard motorcycle.

Yours should fit under the Bashan bikes across the board since they have several models listed on their certificate and all seem to follow under the general VIN LHJPCNBF6CBxxxxxx

The problem I am guessing with the RPS Hawk DLX is that the standard Hawk 250 was certified several years ago and is technically an 'Offroad dirtbike' and is on the EPA's 'Offroad' list (this list includes ATVs, Sides x Sides, etc). So their VIN #'s are probably close together whether they are onroad or offroad. Try putting in the sample VIN for the Hawk DLX and see what pops up that is different from your Bashan.

LC4HCNL55J0000001

old_airhead · 12-09-2020, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TxTaoRider

Lol- Progressive wouldn't let me put full coverage on mine either. Then asked if I had any non stock items or upgrades. I'm thinking, why ask if you're not gonna pay to replace it any way? Lol

That's what my agent asked me, too. She also asked if the bike had a turbo on it. I told her "I wish"...

old_airhead · 12-09-2020, 06:03 PM

calcune: "Does the sample VIN look like your bike's VIN? If not, perhaps yours is a 2020?"

Mine is a 2020. The VIN starts LC4HCNL54L. Where were you able to find the EPA/DOT spreadsheet?

culcune · 12-09-2020, 07:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old_airhead

calcune: "Does the sample VIN look like your bike's VIN? If not, perhaps yours is a 2020?"

Mine is a 2020. The VIN starts LC4HCNL54L. Where were you able to find the EPA/DOT spreadsheet?

Ask Jerryhawk 250. He had posted it months ago and knows how to do it. He should make it a sticky.

12-08-2020, 08:25 PM	#31
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,035	Try this VIN decoder from the NHSTA. I put in my TGB scooter VIN and it gives limited information. When I put in my VIN, the limited information was that it is a 'Motorcycle'. But it is listed as a 'Motorcycle' so perhaps at the DMV they can input your VIN themselves in front of you? https://vpic.nhtsa.dot.gov/decoder __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard Last edited by JerryHawk250; 12-09-2020 at 07:32 AM.
	0

12-08-2020, 08:36 PM	#32
ChipToothy Join Date: Apr 2018 Posts: 819	Update: I was able to see a print off of the MCO and other paper work the state has. They also ran my Vin through the system. I am the only one in Arkansas with that bike lol, bad news it comes up as a for title purposes only dirt bike the same as those Tao Tao 150’s etc in which they found hundreds of. That part makes sense since I know literally were like five different dealerships for those things are. After literally another hour of at the DMV making phone calls and talking they have decided that I can pay a professional mechanic for a modification inspection and to bring that paperwork to the DMV and they will retag it as a modified dirt bike. It’s gonna cost 50-100 bucks for the closest dealerships to me to do it but hey I’ll be back on the road at some point. Heed my warning, before you pay make sure the bike isn’t listed as a “dirt bike”. Mine was fine with the state back in Spring 2018 up until this week. __________________ Bashan Storm: Ebay steel exhaust wrapped, folding shift lever, seat mod, vm26 carb, air pod, dual led scrambler headlamps, windshield mod, led brake/tail light, secondary led brake light (swingarm), Ebay 295mm rear shock, back up CDI (racing unknown), oil cooler, digital gauge cluster,
	2

12-08-2020, 08:51 PM	#33
duck9191 Join Date: May 2019 Location: Port Huron, Michigan Posts: 637	So the dealer screwed up and listened it as something other than "motorcycle" on the mco and they screwed up and issued it a street legal title? __________________ 2020 Triumph Tiger 900 rally. 2018 Bashan Storm 250. pz30b, digital cluster + gear indicator, unifilter and car customs full exhaust. 2019 Taotao 110b boulder atv. The "arm breaker" lol 2007 Honda VTX 1300R. 1974 Suzuki tm125, work in progress 2001 Suzuki Drz 400s.
	1

12-08-2020, 10:38 PM	#34
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,035	Out of curiosity, plug in your VIN into the decoder I linked above and see what pops up. __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard
	0

12-09-2020, 12:55 PM	#39
grumpyunk Join Date: Jul 2018 Location: nw of atlanta Posts: 169	goJimH:"Do you have a copy of the MCO?? Could it be - at original registration someone selected DB and at the time that was find and did not make a difference. I wonder if it is possible to assert that DB was incorrect and it is and was in fact a street legal motorcycle - and get the original title corrected?" Maybe get back to the selling dealer and ask what records they have if you don't have a copy of the MCO. The dealer should maintain records of vehicles sold, though I don't have an idea of how far back. If they sold to others in the same state, you may be able to contact them to see if similar 'happenings' are occurring, and their possible solutions. I have bought two bikes that were not real popular items within the last 6-9 months, and both times the titles got 'hung up' in the state system(GA), and it took a call to the local county DMV office to get them to actually print the title. Also, both bikes needed to have an inspection by the local Genarmes(at no cost, and they came to my home and were extremely pleasant) to insure it was the same machine as on the title. GA law indicates I do not need said inspection, but "SOMEBODY" decided that an inspection, and a 'statement of fact' had to be made to discern a motorcycle from another type of vehicle. I had to attest to hp, speed, number of cylinders, and I don't know what all, but it had to be over 50cc or it was not 'titleable'. Might be interesting to look at recent AR legal 'changes' that would cause such consternation about titling/licensing of off-road vehicles that they would send someone to confiscate an expired license plate. I have NEVER heard of any government group that wanted expired plates. I have multiple on my basement wall... tom __________________ vertical and above ground - my daily goal
	0

12-09-2020, 09:02 AM	#35
old_airhead Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Bloomington, IN Posts: 56	Just bought a Hawk DLX a few weeks back. The Bill of Sale that my state requires description field says "RPS 1 Dirt Bike". I was wondering if that was going to be an issue at the BMV, but things went relatively smoothly. The lady filling out the forms asked if it was a dirt bike. I told her no, it was a street legal dual purpose bike and that there was a DOT sticker on the bike (I don't even know if these exist!). So, it seems that part of the problem is that the seller/importer is not using the proper description on their paperwork - they should probably be made aware of that. My title and registration came a few days ago and both listed the type of vehicle as "MC", so I guess I'm in the clear for at least a year. By the way, Progressive insured the bike as a street bike. They would not offer me full coverage, though, because they said the bike was a grey market vehicle, whatever that means. No big deal, I have maximum liability on it and figure a $2k motorcycle isn't really worth full coverage. Good luck ChipToothy. Keep us posted.
	0

12-09-2020, 09:11 AM	#36
old_airhead Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Bloomington, IN Posts: 56	Just tried culcune's VIN link and got this: Error Text: 6 - Incomplete VIN; 10 - Off-road Vehicle Error – This is not a vehicle identification number (VIN) for a motor vehicle. This indicates that the manufacturer did not certify this product as complying with the Federal motor vehicle safety standards which are applicable to motor vehicles as defined at 49 U.S.C. 30102. What? Did the manufacturer mess up?
	0

12-09-2020, 03:45 PM	#41
discochris Join Date: Apr 2020 Location: Minnesota Posts: 35	Progressive would not give me full coverage either on the Bashan BSR250. Oh well. I plugged my VIN into the decoder, and it does show as a standard motorcycle.
	0

12-09-2020, 06:03 PM	#44
old_airhead Join Date: Nov 2020 Location: Bloomington, IN Posts: 56	calcune: "Does the sample VIN look like your bike's VIN? If not, perhaps yours is a 2020?" Mine is a 2020. The VIN starts LC4HCNL54L. Where were you able to find the EPA/DOT spreadsheet?
	1