China Bike (Two Years and a bunch of $$$ Later) - Page 3

Thumper · 12-18-2023, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zapkin

you just approached this the wrong way. when you come into a persons place, you dont insult it and then ask for assistance. we all know what we know. good luck bud.

Yup. I agree...I can understand the frustration, but gee, the bike cost less than $2000. OP has high expectations for such a remarkably low priced product. The mainstream world of motorcycling is not so cheap.

I still marvel at the high overall usability and yes, quality of the low priced dual sport (Bashan Storm) and enduro (Templar X) I bought and kept. And compared to the bikes that inspired them, and their engines (20-30 year old tech), these contemporary Chinese bikes are definitely better. I would have been so happy to have the performance of a Bashan Storm in 1978. It is just about as heavy, but suspension is way better!

The main difference between these Chinese bikes, and Japanese or European brands like Kawasaki, Yamaha, Honda, KTM, Gas Gas, Husqvarna is NOT just price.

Performance is generally higher and there is not only dealer support but a legacy of tested and model-specific parts out there for these main stream/market brands.

Parts for the main stream bikes are higher priced overall, but thay are easier to match, and more likely to fit. THAT is a huge difference.

You get what you pay for, and there is no reason to complain whatever level you decide to step in on!

bigdano711 · 12-19-2023, 08:38 AM

I feel the urge to weigh in. I learned about these China bikes around May/June of this year by watching YouTube and seeing that clown from Bikes and Beards buy one and abuse it. That right there was a revelation: you can buy a bike off Amazon and have it shipped to your door?? (well, mostly, some of us have to go pick it up from the freight carriers who are likely getting slammed trying to deliver on these orders).

So I found the Hawk on Amazon. I did some Googling and found this site. I read Megadan's sticky on the Hawk...MANY times. I asked questions. I was a nuisance. Then, in late July, my bike arrived. I knew what to expect. I knew what I was in for. So far, the only thing that "broke" is the speedo, which was replaced with a digital dash. I knew it was going to happen. It was a known. Even your gas tank issue is kinduva known, but you have zero right to complain when it was stolen by tweakers and you actually got it back. That by itself is miraculous and cause for celebration. It's like we miss the amazing parts of the story and just focus on the problems. Orale, vato!

Bill Hilly · 12-19-2023, 03:34 PM

I remember a few years ago. The haters of Chinese bikes, would often be under the impression that parts would be nearly impossible to find, and then after that argument, they would act like it's stolen technology, which is funny considering Japan has been notorious in stealing technology. Now it's "well I don't like supporting China", which is also hypocritical, unless the ones saying that apply it to all other purchases they ever make, because the fact is that a great deal of what everyone buys is Chinese made. I have enough experience, and put enough miles on Chinese dual sports to pretty much know that with common sense, and fairly frequent, but simple maintenance, they are dependable, and while the quality control may not be as stringent, most come with some sort of warranty . We all personally know that parts are plentiful, and cheap, and I think that we also know that for their displacement, they make less power than their Japanese counterparts. I think that the fact that they do make less power, means that China tries to prioritize dependability, at the sacrifice of some HP. Know the limits of your suspension, and properly maintain your bike, and I think that most people are happy with them.

bigdano711 · 12-19-2023, 05:32 PM

I say God bless the Chinese people. Their leaders, like ours, not so much. They supply the planet and deserve better treatment. I have hope. Things are changing...I can feel it.

bigdano711 · 12-19-2023, 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaytravels

the first unit looks ok, but the second, Jeff Besos has lost his mind, how is PRIME SHIPPING 2 day September 21st, we all know where that is coming from, and its not an Amazon warehouse!

Thanks for the tips, I would like to reuse mine, but maybe I should just add it up to more wallet spreading for the chino bike (it truly is a theme!)

That is true. I dare you to go buy a Harley or any other top Jap/Euro manufacturer and survive the initial "wallet spreading" on a brand new bike, then the "wallet spreading" for those parts.

I bought the Hawk because I could afford it...barely. No way on anything else. I could have bought used, but I've done that with my first bike (Harley) and won't do it again. I am on a fixed income (disability). The government knows about that purchase. They are trying to kick me off, for sure. Already got some paperwork, only time before I get more.

Anyhow, $60 for a new speedo? Yep, I can do that. $40~$50 for a new chain. Ok. $100 for a new tank. No problem. $70 for a new carb. Sure.

No way I could afford any of that with any other manufacturer out there. Instead, I just gave up on the idea of ever riding again. China bike said F that!

Bill Hilly · 12-19-2023, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigdano711

I say God bless the Chinese people. Their leaders, like ours, not so much. They supply the planet and deserve better treatment. I have hope. Things are changing...I can feel it.

The Chinese were our allies in WW2, and even the Chinese people in general loved the Americans, and were loyal to the point of taking great risk to protect downed aviators, and flight crews. The Japanese were so cruel, and would execute masses of people just under suspicious of aiding Americans. The Japanese were as cruel to the Chinese as Nazis were to Jews. The average German rank, and file soldier wasn't really cruel , but the average Japanese soldier was . I'm sure it left a bitter taste in the mouth of the Chinese to see America, not only allow Hirohito to escape any accountability, but to see America rebuild Japan into what it is today. China is getting too powerful, and it's definitely a threat, but as of now the U.S is their biggest driver of their economy, and they kind of need us.

Thumper · 12-19-2023, 06:59 PM

The X440 is an example of HD collaboration on a cruiser sold in the India market. In China, HD is working with Qianjiang-the Harley-Davidson X500 V-twin cruiser is sold in China. That's great. We are in business competition with the world. Go get 'em!

In the USA, I buy light bulbs for my microwave overhead light, a toaster, clothes (!), Brewery swag (t-shirts/pint glasses/bottle openers), large appliances, furniture, flatscreen TVs, computers, a lamp, a lawn mower, car parts, tools, hardware (especially), etcetra. The list goes on. All of them are either made in, or have up to 80% parts made in China.

So do the loading dock workers, forklift operators deliberately fast drop or stand on end pallettes of flatscreen TVs or coffe makers? No. But they see a Chinese crate bike and something weird happens in there provincial minds.

There could be parts in your car made in Poland, Germany, China, Mexico, etc. Not so much Russia

China is not letting US manufacturers into their market fairly though, and there are obligatory agreements that favor Chinese manufacturing. I guess we do this because we do not have the manufacturing capacity (low cost labor, materials, and horrible environmental protection). So it is indeed a stacked deck. But as I said, the crate bike gets singled out, whereas the coffemakers sail through shipping. Go figure.

XLsior · 12-19-2023, 07:16 PM

International shipping is getting dicey. Panama canal is drying up, Red Sea is in conflict, South China Sea tensions...

Non domestic product and manufacturing that requires outsources parts and supply are going to spike in 'costs' I can't say by how much...but You're probably already feeling the effects of it...

If you had any plans or intentions on making a purchase on a 'significant' item I probably wouldn't put off for the foreseeable future.

Zapkin · 12-20-2023, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigdano711

That is true. I dare you to go buy a Harley or any other top Jap/Euro manufacturer and survive the initial "wallet spreading" on a brand new bike, then the "wallet spreading" for those parts.

I bought the Hawk because I could afford it...barely. No way on anything else. I could have bought used, but I've done that with my first bike (Harley) and won't do it again. I am on a fixed income (disability). The government knows about that purchase. They are trying to kick me off, for sure. Already got some paperwork, only time before I get more.

Anyhow, $60 for a new speedo? Yep, I can do that. $40~$50 for a new chain. Ok. $100 for a new tank. No problem. $70 for a new carb. Sure.

No way I could afford any of that with any other manufacturer out there. Instead, I just gave up on the idea of ever riding again. China bike said F that!

Same here. The only way I could have a bike is if I had credit (no, no, no, I am fiscally irresponsible) or a loan (no again) or layaway (YES!). I got burnt a little by PSM when they put the new bike on sale for less than I paid for a refurb the day after mine was delivered, but whatever, since then they've been good.

Thumper · 12-20-2023, 11:13 AM

Just pulled the failing exhaust fan from the ceiling in the main bath. It is a standard Broan drum type blower. Made in America in the 50s. I can clean it up and oil it for now. I've replaced these little 3000 rpm blower motors before, and the blower drum is just fine. But, but guess where the OEM official replacement motor part (available through Grainger or Amazon) is made...
~$78, plus tax.

It is $90 for a brand new complete blower also made in China, but really don't want to climb up into the crawl space over the bathroom (blown insulation)

What was this thread about? Oh yeah, bikes from China. Or nearly everything is

Edit: Cleaned up the blower and oiled the motor. Quiet and powerful like new. Bullet dodged. No Chinese parts needed, this time.

Dabby40 · 12-29-2023, 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaytravels

I am no stranger to china bikes, they are sold nice shiny new, cheap price and they WILL break on you ..... I bought a RPS Hawk 250

Not all Chinese bikes are made equally. Bought my Bashan Storm 250 not too long ago used and it runs great. Only major thing it needed replace was the rear wheel cushion assembly but that just happens overtime and hard use. These bikes are not "the last bike" you will ever own for a long shot but they're not all garbage. Your mileage with a Honda, KTM, or even a Suzuki for that matter can be exactly the same. Only difference is people trust them more and that's coming from someone who owned several dirt bikes growing up.

Really hope there's a chinese bike tier list on this site somewhere....would really help people in buying better bikes from China.

TominMO · 12-30-2023, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dabby40

Not all Chinese bikes are made equally. Bought my Bashan Storm 250 not too long ago used and it runs great. Only major thing it needed replace was the rear wheel cushion assembly but that just happens overtime and hard use. These bikes are not "the last bike" you will ever own for a long shot but they're not all garbage. Your mileage with a Honda, KTM, or even a Suzuki for that matter can be exactly the same. Only difference is people trust them more and that's coming from someone who owned several dirt bikes growing up.

Really hope there's a chinese bike tier list on this site somewhere....would really help people in buying better bikes from China.

Same thing in the auto industry. The infamous Yugo for example.

And even major brands came out with clunkers from time to time. Ford Pinto, Chevy Vega and the AMC Gremlin immediately come to mind. Plenty of others too of course. The people really in the know are the professional independent used car salesmen. They know all the horror stories about reliability and servicing.

Discoveror · 12-30-2023, 04:26 PM

I've heard that only about 4% of the Chinese are CCP. I suspect that most of the rest are just hard-working stiffs (like us?), trying to make a living for their family.

I feel that just because the CCP are 'bad to the bone' doesn't make the other 96% bad; grouping people categorically, rather than evaluating them individually, is the very definition of racism.

Are the Chinese CCP leaders 'bad'? ... you betcha!
Are OUR 'leaders' any better? ... ponder that awhile.

12-19-2023, 08:38 AM	#32
bigdano711 Join Date: Jun 2023 Location: Big Piney, WY Posts: 426	I feel the urge to weigh in. I learned about these China bikes around May/June of this year by watching YouTube and seeing that clown from Bikes and Beards buy one and abuse it. That right there was a revelation: you can buy a bike off Amazon and have it shipped to your door?? (well, mostly, some of us have to go pick it up from the freight carriers who are likely getting slammed trying to deliver on these orders). So I found the Hawk on Amazon. I did some Googling and found this site. I read Megadan's sticky on the Hawk...MANY times. I asked questions. I was a nuisance. Then, in late July, my bike arrived. I knew what to expect. I knew what I was in for. So far, the only thing that "broke" is the speedo, which was replaced with a digital dash. I knew it was going to happen. It was a known. Even your gas tank issue is kinduva known, but you have zero right to complain when it was stolen by tweakers and you actually got it back. That by itself is miraculous and cause for celebration. It's like we miss the amazing parts of the story and just focus on the problems. Orale, vato! __________________ 2023 Hawk 250 from XPRO off of Amazon MOUNTAIN MAN RC + MOTO on YouTube "If there were more bloody noses, there would be less wars." - Hagbard Celine "Someday, after mastering the waves, the winds, the tides and gravity, we shall harness for God the energies of love and then, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire." - Pierre Teilhard de Chardin
	5

12-19-2023, 05:32 PM	#34
bigdano711 Join Date: Jun 2023 Location: Big Piney, WY Posts: 426	I say God bless the Chinese people. Their leaders, like ours, not so much. They supply the planet and deserve better treatment. I have hope. Things are changing...I can feel it. __________________ 2023 Hawk 250 from XPRO off of Amazon MOUNTAIN MAN RC + MOTO on YouTube "If there were more bloody noses, there would be less wars." - Hagbard Celine "Someday, after mastering the waves, the winds, the tides and gravity, we shall harness for God the energies of love and then, for the second time in the history of the world, man will have discovered fire." - Pierre Teilhard de Chardin
	0

12-19-2023, 06:59 PM	#37
Thumper Join Date: Feb 2021 Location: Kansas City Posts: 2,323	The X440 is an example of HD collaboration on a cruiser sold in the India market. In China, HD is working with Qianjiang-the Harley-Davidson X500 V-twin cruiser is sold in China. That's great. We are in business competition with the world. Go get 'em! In the USA, I buy light bulbs for my microwave overhead light, a toaster, clothes (!), Brewery swag (t-shirts/pint glasses/bottle openers), large appliances, furniture, flatscreen TVs, computers, a lamp, a lawn mower, car parts, tools, hardware (especially), etcetra. The list goes on. All of them are either made in, or have up to 80% parts made in China. So do the loading dock workers, forklift operators deliberately fast drop or stand on end pallettes of flatscreen TVs or coffe makers? No. But they see a Chinese crate bike and something weird happens in there provincial minds. There could be parts in your car made in Poland, Germany, China, Mexico, etc. Not so much Russia China is not letting US manufacturers into their market fairly though, and there are obligatory agreements that favor Chinese manufacturing. I guess we do this because we do not have the manufacturing capacity (low cost labor, materials, and horrible environmental protection). So it is indeed a stacked deck. But as I said, the crate bike gets singled out, whereas the coffemakers sail through shipping. Go figure. __________________ -2022 5 speed Templar X Orange, OEM 51T rear sprocket, 14T front sprocket -NOS 2020 KTM 250SX (2-stroke motocross), less than 10 hours on it
	1

12-20-2023, 11:13 AM	#40
Thumper Join Date: Feb 2021 Location: Kansas City Posts: 2,323	Just pulled the failing exhaust fan from the ceiling in the main bath. It is a standard Broan drum type blower. Made in America in the 50s. I can clean it up and oil it for now. I've replaced these little 3000 rpm blower motors before, and the blower drum is just fine. But, but guess where the OEM official replacement motor part (available through Grainger or Amazon) is made... ~$78, plus tax. It is $90 for a brand new complete blower also made in China, but really don't want to climb up into the crawl space over the bathroom (blown insulation) What was this thread about? Oh yeah, bikes from China. Or nearly everything is Edit: Cleaned up the blower and oiled the motor. Quiet and powerful like new. Bullet dodged. No Chinese parts needed, this time. __________________ -2022 5 speed Templar X Orange, OEM 51T rear sprocket, 14T front sprocket -NOS 2020 KTM 250SX (2-stroke motocross), less than 10 hours on it Last edited by Thumper; 12-20-2023 at 03:51 PM.
	1

12-30-2023, 04:26 PM	#43
Discoveror Join Date: Nov 2022 Location: Wyoming Posts: 88	my perspective I've heard that only about 4% of the Chinese are CCP. I suspect that most of the rest are just hard-working stiffs (like us?), trying to make a living for their family. I feel that just because the CCP are 'bad to the bone' doesn't make the other 96% bad; grouping people categorically, rather than evaluating them individually, is the very definition of racism. Are the Chinese CCP leaders 'bad'? ... you betcha! Are OUR 'leaders' any better? ... ponder that awhile. Last edited by Discoveror; 01-05-2024 at 01:34 PM.
	1

12-19-2023, 03:34 PM	#33
Bill Hilly Join Date: Feb 2021 Posts: 946	I remember a few years ago. The haters of Chinese bikes, would often be under the impression that parts would be nearly impossible to find, and then after that argument, they would act like it's stolen technology, which is funny considering Japan has been notorious in stealing technology. Now it's "well I don't like supporting China", which is also hypocritical, unless the ones saying that apply it to all other purchases they ever make, because the fact is that a great deal of what everyone buys is Chinese made. I have enough experience, and put enough miles on Chinese dual sports to pretty much know that with common sense, and fairly frequent, but simple maintenance, they are dependable, and while the quality control may not be as stringent, most come with some sort of warranty . We all personally know that parts are plentiful, and cheap, and I think that we also know that for their displacement, they make less power than their Japanese counterparts. I think that the fact that they do make less power, means that China tries to prioritize dependability, at the sacrifice of some HP. Know the limits of your suspension, and properly maintain your bike, and I think that most people are happy with them.
	2

12-19-2023, 07:16 PM	#38
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,293	International shipping is getting dicey. Panama canal is drying up, Red Sea is in conflict, South China Sea tensions... Non domestic product and manufacturing that requires outsources parts and supply are going to spike in 'costs' I can't say by how much...but You're probably already feeling the effects of it... If you had any plans or intentions on making a purchase on a 'significant' item I probably wouldn't put off for the foreseeable future.
	0