Are there RPS Magicians and Hawks being sold with off-road VINs?

DualSport · 10-02-2018, 07:00 AM

I've seen a couple obscured stories on here where people are getting RPS magician and hawk bikes and finding out the VIN has the "type" field as "offroad". Which means even South Dakota won't tag it. It can basically only be titled like a dirt bike..

I get a magician from Q9 today, and I suspect I'm going to go with my "MOTORCYCLE" MCO, insurance, and bill of sale to the tag office and find out the VIN is off-road and it's basically re-VIN or title and sale it as a dirt bike since I can't use it on the streets..

Tag office agent software will refuse to issue a tag for a vin without the right "type" value.

**JerryHawk250** · 10-02-2018, 07:24 AM

That's a new one. First time I hear anybody having that issue.

Torgo · 10-02-2018, 09:31 AM

As far as I know there's nothing standard in the VIN to indicate that, as those fields are customized by each manufacturer.

However, the engine will have an EPA certification that indicates if it's "highway" or "off-road." The EPA puts out a database annually. The Hawk and Magician have the same 229cc engine, and it's "off-road."

https://www.epa.gov/sites/production...6-present.xlsx

Here in Texas, they don't tie registration to the EPA certification, but some states may.

**JerryHawk250** · 10-02-2018, 09:47 AM

They are probably looking for a Vin Tag which the Hawk and magician do not have. You can have one made up and should look simular this. Of course with the correct information. lol

itsnt4me · 10-02-2018, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryHawk250

They are probably looking for a Vin Tag which the Hawk and magician do not have. You can have one made up and should look simular this. Of course with the correct information. lol

My 2018 Hawk has an almost unremovable sticker (only took an hour and a little touch up paint) on the right crankcase that states among other things its OFF ROAD VEHICLE. In Alabama they will fail your registration if they see that sticker. They should have checked the VIN only. So its different DMV location for me tomorrow. Stupid is as stupid does I suppose.

slowroller · 10-02-2018, 11:21 PM

That could be rather bad for there sales as most people want a dual sport type bike. I even was going to pull the trigger on a new one very soon.

culcune · 10-02-2018, 11:25 PM

These bikes are clearly on the EPA off-road database as 'Offroad dirtbikes' or something to that effect. Several states don't care what kind of bike it is as long as it has a minimum of street equipment; i.e. Arizona will plate a quad or side by side, etc. without regard to the EPA certification. The bike has snowballed for the most part with street registration in up to 35 states now according to JerryHawk 250's thread on successful registration for the bike. I would love to get one, but now that I am in California, have a snowball's chance in heck in getting one street registered, or even off-road stickered here. It is a 49-state bike according to EPA off-road certification. I doubt California would ever CARB certify it due to all the street equipment (CARB acts like a state EPA and DOT combined). Ironically, several years ago, when Hensim rolled out the Hawk's father which was one of the first available Chinese "250"enduros with an engine larger than 200cc, I recall seeing some rather ugly versions of them advertised on powersportsmax or superiorpowersports with all street equipment removed, and plastic that looked like they had remolded street plastic into "off-road" plastic. They were Hensims, but de-streeted. Might have had to do with California or even a stricter DOT. With the child of the Hensim, the Hawk, doing very well nowadays, it appears the loophole is ignored by the feds, which is surprising...refreshing, but surprising!

Torgo · 10-03-2018, 02:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by culcune

I doubt California would ever CARB certify it due to all the street equipment (CARB acts like a state EPA and DOT combined).

Interestingly - as far as the emissions part of CARB goes, it just barely misses, according to what they indicate in the EPA off-road spreadsheet.

https://govt.westlaw.com/calregs/Doc...t%29&bhcp=1%20

The EPA spreadsheet indicates 1.015 HC and 9.1 CO vs. 1.0 HC and 12 CO per CA for a 229cc engine displacement.

Of course, I believe every specification published by Chinese manufactures and their distributors as if God himself had told me directly.

culcune · 10-04-2018, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Torgo

Of course, I believe every specification published by Chinese manufactures and their distributors as if God himself had told me directly.

DualSport · 10-05-2018, 08:50 PM

8th value in a VIN is suppose to be a type, next i think is year like G=2016 or X for irrelevant security code

I've had 150cc scooters with the same MCO and stamped VIN that registered and tagged with nothing but proof of insurance, MCO, and bill of sale and about $170.00 here in NC. There is definitely something up with these somehow..

10-02-2018, 07:00 AM	#1
DualSport Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 173	Are there RPS Magicians and Hawks being sold with off-road VINs? I've seen a couple obscured stories on here where people are getting RPS magician and hawk bikes and finding out the VIN has the "type" field as "offroad". Which means even South Dakota won't tag it. It can basically only be titled like a dirt bike.. I get a magician from Q9 today, and I suspect I'm going to go with my "MOTORCYCLE" MCO, insurance, and bill of sale to the tag office and find out the VIN is off-road and it's basically re-VIN or title and sale it as a dirt bike since I can't use it on the streets.. Tag office agent software will refuse to issue a tag for a vin without the right "type" value.
	0

10-02-2018, 07:24 AM	#2
JerryHawk250 Moderator Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Houma, La. Posts: 11,574	That's a new one. First time I hear anybody having that issue. __________________ 2023 Lifan Lycan 250 Chopper 2023 Venom Evader 2022 Lifan KPX250 2020 Kawasaki Vulcan S 2004 Honda ST 1300 2016 Black Hawk 250 (sold) Keihin PE30 carb,125 main,38 slow.Pod filter,ported & decked head 10:1 CR,Direct Ignition Coil,15/40Sprockets,NGK DPR8EIX-9,De-Cat,Dual Oil Cooler,Digital Cluster 2016 Cazador180 XL 2014 Coolster150 JerryHawk250.com My YouTube Channel
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10-02-2018, 09:47 AM	#4
JerryHawk250 Moderator Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Houma, La. Posts: 11,574	They are probably looking for a Vin Tag which the Hawk and magician do not have. You can have one made up and should look simular this. Of course with the correct information. lol __________________ 2023 Lifan Lycan 250 Chopper 2023 Venom Evader 2022 Lifan KPX250 2020 Kawasaki Vulcan S 2004 Honda ST 1300 2016 Black Hawk 250 (sold) Keihin PE30 carb,125 main,38 slow.Pod filter,ported & decked head 10:1 CR,Direct Ignition Coil,15/40Sprockets,NGK DPR8EIX-9,De-Cat,Dual Oil Cooler,Digital Cluster 2016 Cazador180 XL 2014 Coolster150 JerryHawk250.com My YouTube Channel
	0

10-02-2018, 11:25 PM	#7
culcune Join Date: May 2006 Location: Yuma, Arizona Posts: 9,035	These bikes are clearly on the EPA off-road database as 'Offroad dirtbikes' or something to that effect. Several states don't care what kind of bike it is as long as it has a minimum of street equipment; i.e. Arizona will plate a quad or side by side, etc. without regard to the EPA certification. The bike has snowballed for the most part with street registration in up to 35 states now according to JerryHawk 250's thread on successful registration for the bike. I would love to get one, but now that I am in California, have a snowball's chance in heck in getting one street registered, or even off-road stickered here. It is a 49-state bike according to EPA off-road certification. I doubt California would ever CARB certify it due to all the street equipment (CARB acts like a state EPA and DOT combined). Ironically, several years ago, when Hensim rolled out the Hawk's father which was one of the first available Chinese "250"enduros with an engine larger than 200cc, I recall seeing some rather ugly versions of them advertised on powersportsmax or superiorpowersports with all street equipment removed, and plastic that looked like they had remolded street plastic into "off-road" plastic. They were Hensims, but de-streeted. Might have had to do with California or even a stricter DOT. With the child of the Hensim, the Hawk, doing very well nowadays, it appears the loophole is ignored by the feds, which is surprising...refreshing, but surprising! __________________ "They say that life's a carousel, spinning fast you got to ride it well..." TGB Delivery Scooter 150 TMEC 200 Enduro--carcass is sadly rotting in the backyard
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10-02-2018, 09:31 AM	#3
Torgo Join Date: Oct 2015 Location: Texas Posts: 93	As far as I know there's nothing standard in the VIN to indicate that, as those fields are customized by each manufacturer. However, the engine will have an EPA certification that indicates if it's "highway" or "off-road." The EPA puts out a database annually. The Hawk and Magician have the same 229cc engine, and it's "off-road." https://www.epa.gov/sites/production...6-present.xlsx Here in Texas, they don't tie registration to the EPA certification, but some states may.
	1

10-02-2018, 11:21 PM	#6
slowroller Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 77	That could be rather bad for there sales as most people want a dual sport type bike. I even was going to pull the trigger on a new one very soon.
	0

10-05-2018, 08:50 PM	#10
DualSport Join Date: Sep 2018 Posts: 173	8th value in a VIN is suppose to be a type, next i think is year like G=2016 or X for irrelevant security code I've had 150cc scooters with the same MCO and stamped VIN that registered and tagged with nothing but proof of insurance, MCO, and bill of sale and about $170.00 here in NC. There is definitely something up with these somehow..
	0