Hi Bird 250 Clutch Shake

Dragon · 10-01-2009, 12:02 AM

Sometimes when I release the clutch lever, the bike shakes. It feels like the clutch spring is weak. Also, the lever has to be released almost all the way before hitting the friction zone. The bike has 9600 miles. Does this mean I need need clutch and springs?

FastDoc · 10-01-2009, 11:14 AM

Check your slack in the cable, it might be excessive. Ideal is usually 1-2 mm gap at the clutch lever.

Some shuddering occurs with cheap clutches.

I doubt the springs would wear per se.

Could mean you are due for an oil change.

Check cable and oil. If both are OK I'd say get a new clutch plus/minus springs, maybe a cable, and a gasket for the cover.

lego1970 · 10-01-2009, 02:38 PM

As mentioned, try adjusting your clutch first and or changing the oil. If that doesn't work my guess is that you need a new clutch however I'm not 100% on that. If you replace the clutch go ahead and spend the $10 dollars for new springs. Also while most low hp engines don't require the steel disc to be changed out on the first clutch job, you still want to measure the thickness of the steel disc so you don't prematurely wear out $70 bucks worth of friction plates. To measure the steel disc, you will need to know what the acceptable specs are. Some specs call for measuring out all the disc sandwiched together, other specs call for measuring each disc individually. You'll need a micrometer and measure at least every 90 degrees to check for warpage. Good luck.

FastDoc · 10-01-2009, 04:11 PM

FWIW, I've never worn out steel plates, even on stupid fast bikes, like a GS1100 and ZX11. Warping them is another story... :?

Dragon · 10-01-2009, 04:36 PM

By the way, this bike has been thru alot of adversity. I have gone blasting across Texas on it. Actually, I'm kind'a surprised the engine is still running so well. At some point, I decided to sell it; so I blasted wide open throttle everywhere I went. When I realize it was refusing to die, I decided to keep it and stop driving like a maniac.

lego1970 · 10-01-2009, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FastDoc

FWIW, I've never worn out steel plates, even on stupid fast bikes, like a GS1100 and ZX11. Warping them is another story... :?

They will. Like I said not as likely on a low hp machine on the first couple clutch jobs, but on 100-175hp sportbikes that get flogged all day doing trackdays or flying around the streets, they will wear down. I've had a few sportbikes and even when the steel disc are in spec most trackday enthusiast will go ahead and change them out. Even on a 18hp chinabike, it's silly not to check them when you have the clutch pack apart. Your in there anyway, and you can get a cheap micrometer from Harbor Freight for about $10. The piece of mind alone is worth that.

FastDoc · 10-01-2009, 06:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lego1970

Quote:

Originally Posted by FastDoc

FWIW, I've never worn out steel plates, even on stupid fast bikes, like a GS1100 and ZX11. Warping them is another story... :?

They will. Like I said not as likely on a low hp machine on the first couple clutch jobs, but on 100-175hp sportbikes that get flogged all day doing trackdays or flying around the streets, they will wear down. I've had a few sportbikes and even when the steel disc are in spec most trackday enthusiast will go ahead and change them out. Even on a 18hp chinabike, it's silly not to check them when you have the clutch pack apart. Your in there anyway, and you can get a cheap micrometer from Harbor Freight for about $10. The piece of mind alone is worth that.

Yup. I agree. I'm just wondering about availibility.

Weldangrind · 10-01-2009, 10:38 PM

Dragon, your reference to adversity makes me wonder if the Chinese springs are now too soft or are inconsistent. If they've been overheated (perhaps by trying to climb out of a mudhole), they might be compromised, despite the relatively low power engine.

Perhaps you'd like to dismantle the clutch for inspection, and if the plates aren't warped and the friction discs aren't terribly worn, you could just replace the springs and go. I'll bet that generic clutch springs for a Honda would be the right size with a little more clamping pressure.

lego1970 · 10-02-2009, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Yup. I agree. I'm just wondering about availibility.

I don't know. I guess whatever the engine is cloned after. Probably something like Honda as mentioned above. Worse case senerio, I'm sure DP or some other clutch manufacture could tell you what you need if you pull them out and give them the O.D., I.D, teeth width, etc. dimensions.
The gasket for the cover may be another thing if you can't figure out the excact engine your bike is cloned after, but I'm sure there is some form-a-gasket stuff out there that would work if in a bind.

Cal25 · 10-05-2009, 07:55 AM

I came up with a different possibility. In another post you mentioned a worn out swingarm bushing. Could it be that under accelleration, the chain tention pulls the swingarm alignment to the point that the rear sprocket is no longer aligned? I can picture the chain riding on the top of a tooth on the sprocket briefly before setting back in its propper location. That might be the shuddering and shaking that you are experiencing.

Dragon · 10-05-2009, 11:16 AM

Yeah, I still need to replace the swing arm bushing. That was suppose to be my next project.

Besides the shaking, the clutch feels very different from when the bike was new. I also have a Lifan sport bike, and the clutches on my two bikes are like day and night, in terms of feel. On the sport bike, the clutch just feels right. On the Hi Bird, it just doesn't. The Hi Bird is really getting old; maybe I'm expecting too much.

I might tackle the swing arm busing before messing with the clutch.

Dragon · 10-13-2009, 10:23 AM

Wow, the oil got changed, and the clutch feels alot better. I didn't realize
how long it has been.

10-01-2009, 12:02 AM	#1
Dragon Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Tejas Posts: 834	Hi Bird 250 Clutch Shake Sometimes when I release the clutch lever, the bike shakes. It feels like the clutch spring is weak. Also, the lever has to be released almost all the way before hitting the friction zone. The bike has 9600 miles. Does this mean I need need clutch and springs? __________________ Chinabikeless
	0

10-01-2009, 11:14 AM	#2
FastDoc Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Southeastern Washington desert Posts: 14,761	Check your slack in the cable, it might be excessive. Ideal is usually 1-2 mm gap at the clutch lever. Some shuddering occurs with cheap clutches. I doubt the springs would wear per se. Could mean you are due for an oil change. Check cable and oil. If both are OK I'd say get a new clutch plus/minus springs, maybe a cable, and a gasket for the cover. __________________ Happy to serve.
	0

10-01-2009, 04:11 PM	#4
FastDoc Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Southeastern Washington desert Posts: 14,761	FWIW, I've never worn out steel plates, even on stupid fast bikes, like a GS1100 and ZX11. Warping them is another story... :? __________________ Happy to serve.
	0

10-01-2009, 04:36 PM	#5
Dragon Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Tejas Posts: 834	By the way, this bike has been thru alot of adversity. I have gone blasting across Texas on it. Actually, I'm kind'a surprised the engine is still running so well. At some point, I decided to sell it; so I blasted wide open throttle everywhere I went. When I realize it was refusing to die, I decided to keep it and stop driving like a maniac. __________________ Chinabikeless
	0

10-01-2009, 10:38 PM	#8
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	Dragon, your reference to adversity makes me wonder if the Chinese springs are now too soft or are inconsistent. If they've been overheated (perhaps by trying to climb out of a mudhole), they might be compromised, despite the relatively low power engine. Perhaps you'd like to dismantle the clutch for inspection, and if the plates aren't warped and the friction discs aren't terribly worn, you could just replace the springs and go. I'll bet that generic clutch springs for a Honda would be the right size with a little more clamping pressure. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	0

10-01-2009, 02:38 PM	#3
lego1970 Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Blue Springs, Missouri. United States Posts: 505	As mentioned, try adjusting your clutch first and or changing the oil. If that doesn't work my guess is that you need a new clutch however I'm not 100% on that. If you replace the clutch go ahead and spend the $10 dollars for new springs. Also while most low hp engines don't require the steel disc to be changed out on the first clutch job, you still want to measure the thickness of the steel disc so you don't prematurely wear out $70 bucks worth of friction plates. To measure the steel disc, you will need to know what the acceptable specs are. Some specs call for measuring out all the disc sandwiched together, other specs call for measuring each disc individually. You'll need a micrometer and measure at least every 90 degrees to check for warpage. Good luck.
	0

10-05-2009, 07:55 AM	#10
Cal25 Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Terrell and Grapevine Tx. Posts: 1,585	I came up with a different possibility. In another post you mentioned a worn out swingarm bushing. Could it be that under accelleration, the chain tention pulls the swingarm alignment to the point that the rear sprocket is no longer aligned? I can picture the chain riding on the top of a tooth on the sprocket briefly before setting back in its propper location. That might be the shuddering and shaking that you are experiencing.
	0

10-05-2009, 11:16 AM	#11
Dragon Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Tejas Posts: 834	Yeah, I still need to replace the swing arm bushing. That was suppose to be my next project. Besides the shaking, the clutch feels very different from when the bike was new. I also have a Lifan sport bike, and the clutches on my two bikes are like day and night, in terms of feel. On the sport bike, the clutch just feels right. On the Hi Bird, it just doesn't. The Hi Bird is really getting old; maybe I'm expecting too much. I might tackle the swing arm busing before messing with the clutch. __________________ Chinabikeless
	0

10-13-2009, 10:23 AM	#12
Dragon Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Tejas Posts: 834	Wow, the oil got changed, and the clutch feels alot better. I didn't realize how long it has been. __________________ Chinabikeless
	0