Hi from Florida -- 50cc, upgrading to 150cc

[knappster]

Hey, everyone, new to the site ...

I currently own a (bought used, cheap) 50cc Znen scooter that I've been very happy with for the price. It's branded as an Italica, but my impression is that company imports various Chinese models, slaps its name on them, and sells them to the large American market through local scooter dealerships.

I need a bigger bike -- I'm surprised the 50cc's engine hasn't blown up, as there's no way to avoid several miles on a 60mph "country highway" to get anywhere from my house out in the sticks.

At the moment, I'm awaiting the arrival of another Italica-branded scooter, brand new, the Bulldog 150, which seems to be a clone of the Honda Navi "scootercycle" -- CVT transmission, but "mini-moto" motorcycle type body.

I settled on that due to price, after looking at "real motorcycles" that were cheap but old, and at the Navi, which is theoretically about the same price but which Honda dealerships tack a bunch of fees onto. A clearance (new) 2023 Navi was advertised as $1,396, but it was gone when I got to the dealership and I was told another one, same listed price, could be found ... for about "$3,000 out the door." The Bulldog came to less than $2,200 "out the door" (price plus taxes, title, and tags).

Even beyond price, I'm happy with my decision. The engine is larger and there's a much larger after-market for performance upgrades (exhausts, clutches, variators, carbs, etc.). It will never be a "long freeway trip" bike, but I suspect it can be made to comfortably cruise at 55-60, and I'm sure I'll be seeking advice here at ChinaRiders on how to go about getting there.

Side note: If anyone knows what other brand names the "Italica Bulldog 150" is sold under, please let me know. Under that make/model, search results are few and far between.

[J4Fun]

Just wondering why at that price you didn’t go with a 250 dual sport type bike?

[JerryHawk250]

Welcome aboard!

[knappster]

Originally Posted by J4Fun

Just wondering why at that price you didn’t go with a 250 dual sport type bike?

I considered everything up to and including 500cc cruisers, and strongly considered something like the BSR Raven. Here's why I settled on a 150cc Chinese "scootercycle":

1. After a year on a scooter, my muscle memory tells me that the left handgrip is a brake, not a clutch. This gave me some problems during the course for getting my motorcycle license. I plan to start riding friends' dirt bikes and such until I get over that, but for commutes to town and back, etc., I'd rather not be learning the hard way on the road (pictures vary, and the Bulldog MAY have a foot pedal for the rear brake, right handgrip for front brake, but I've also seen photos where it looks like standard two-handgrip scooter brakes).

2. Price/convenience combo. I wasn't finding what I wanted used locally, dealers charge a "dealer fee" and "freight fee," etc. I could have ordered from Amazon, and still would have ended up at least $1,500 into it, hoped I didn't get anything defective, had to assemble it myself (which I wouldn't have minded, since I want to get to know my bike very well), and then had to sit at DMV for hours to get tags. The scooter dealer I work with doesn't charge all that extra stuff, gave me a "return customer" discount of $200, and when I go there to pick up the bike I will leave with a title and temp tags instead of having the DMV wait. I was hoping I'd get this one for a little less than I did, but I'm saving time, and this dealer has been nothing but honest and accommodating with me. He didn't rip me off on the first scooter, he's given me good advice, and he even TRIED to find me a 250cc scooter, used, in my price range when I wasn't really considering something "motorcycle-like." But there was nothing around locally (this is a college town -- 90% of the scooters are 50cc and almost all the rest are 150s).

3. I really, really, really like the looks of this bike (pic below if I can figure that part out), and had pretty much settled on a Navi until I saw the price inflation on them. Who knows, I may eventually find myself riding a Harley Iron 883, but for now I'm just in transition from "euro-style scooter" to "mini-Moto" for town/country highway use.

[culcune]

Originally Posted by knappster

Hey, everyone, new to the site ...

Side note: If anyone knows what other brand names the "Italica Bulldog 150" is sold under, please let me know. Under that make/model, search results are few and far between.

Welcome to here!

Znen is a decent quality product. They in fact do OEM for several 'brands' in the US. I understand that with Chinese manufactured bikes, if a brand wants a better quality bike, they pay more. In other words, if you want to be the low-price leader, you will get the absolute lowest quality. If you want to have a stronger reputation, then you will pay more, even if the bike looks identical. Something like that.

I am pleasantly surprised at seeing Italica. They used to be the Mexican leader in powersports in the 2000s. I used to see them all the time here in Yuma with cross-border commuters driving up from Mexico. If I recall, they were sold and financed through a large and popular Mexican department store chain--financing kept them popular. Since I haven't seen any here in Yuma, and I rarely go to Mexico, they haven't been on my personal 'radar' for years. It's interesting to see them sold new in Florida. However, there have been 'brands' that take defunct brands and re-use the name. The online retailer Motobuys were notorious for re-labeling brands of bikes that had gone out of business a few years earlier. So, that could be the case with Italica. Do you have a link to their corporate site?

Edit: Ok, found their site. https://www.italicamotors.com/produc.../bulldog-150cc That one looks similar to and utilizes the same scooter concept as the Icebear PMZ-150 M1. Icebear is a manufacturer but I am guessing Italica is a 'brand'. They may import the Bulldog from another OEM, or it is one that Znen manufactures for them in addition to all their scooters.

[ProDigit]

If you want to do 60, you really will want a 250cc Chinese bike instead.
Even my Lifan X-pect 200 can do 60-70 mph, with a little headwind, speed can quickly drop to 55-60mph.

[knappster]

Thanks for the info! The Italica Bulldog 150 does look a lot like that Icebear. Some fairing differences, but close, so they may just be a close variant. I noticed the Mexican market -- I'm pretty sure Italica BIT 150, sold in Mexico, is almost exactly the same bike.

[knappster]

If I don't make 60, it won't break my heart. I just plan to up-mod and see if I can get to 60 top, 50 "cruise that doesn't seem to strain the bike."

My original plan was to get a 250 or larger that was actually viable for long freeway trips. I didn't find what I wanted in my price range, new or used (other than a beat up 250 that the seller didn't respond on, even though it was still sitting there and I was offering his asking price if it ran, his listing was vague).

After that, I was thinking "smaller, and risk an Amazon buy-and-build-yourself machine." But when I saw the Navi, and then this clone of it, I kind of fell in love and went and found a little more money (my initial budget was $1500 "out the door, title, tags, everything).

[cheesy]

Welcome.