Phil's Yanmar/new business line topic

[TheRealWorld]

Very sad news Phil. What will your next line be?

[phil]

Its not over yet, im just thinking i have a few problems that need resolved and it depends on what they do. i think i have been understanding but enough is enough.
as for the parts most parts a available with a few exceptions but i havent found anything that couldnt worked around (knobbie tires come to mind) fish has a complant and he has a right and is right. zong is still the top of heap and the best for parts in the chinese bikes but thats not a real bragging point when you look at the heap, and for all the trouble is it worth it ?? but to the orginal question the next will be yanmar and we will see if i keep the bikes

[FastDoc]

Originally Posted by phil

Its not over yet, im just thinking i have a few problems that need resolved and it depends on what they do. i think i have been understanding but enough is enough.
as for the parts most parts a available with a few exceptions but i havent found anything that couldnt worked around (knobbie tires come to mind) fish has a complant and he has a right and is right. zong is still the top of heap and the best for parts in the chinese bikes but thats not a real bragging point when you look at the heap, and for all the trouble is it worth it ?? but to the orginal question the next will be yanmar and we will see if i keep the bikes

Does Yanmar also make tractors? I seem to remmeber seeing them in a catalog....

[katoranger]

Yanmar makes tractors and engines. The chinese also clone them too.

Allen

[phil]

yes yanmar makes tractors. im looking at what is called gray market. right now im waiting for my bank to call to see if that goes. and im waiting on the call from zong to see what they are going to do, and half expecting manny to join the forum to let him explain whats going on,, then the other half says nobody will do anything. manny did do a lot of explaining today and my guess he isnt totally to blame and a lot is out of his hands but im not saying that the company as a whole dont have problems im also looking at a company called coolster and would like some input from you guys. but i think if i drop the zongs im out. in va you have to be a dealer to sell atvs, that means i have to have a franchise with a state approved motorcycle company and after all the trouble with the ones ive had i have to wonder

[TheRealWorld]

I am a business man, and if I had a product and a following like Zong, I don't think I would be having problems. Phil, can you share anything that they told you? I was trying to convince our local Roketa dealer to go with zong!

[phil]

if he has had any problems and he can put up with roketa he is a saint its not a real big deal but, they worked fishmans order at a snails pace, they do have most parts and i understand they dont have everything. the part thats got me is i ordered a stock of parts, about 1500-2000$, and a lot was shorted. i ordered the knobbies at a ridiculous price, most of it ended up being 18and 21" tires, which are almost worthless. both happened last year for the last month ive been begging for credit, they could even cheat me some, just make me feel better. but truth is nobody has done anything. i dont want a check, credit on my next order. and honestly the sales arent good in my area. i do better with smaller atvs. i still have the first (and only) 2 storms i ordered. the scooters sell ok . mostly i tired of having to try push so hard to get mediocre service. i called them at least every other day on fishmans order, and it took 2 or 3 weeks and im still waiting on a invoice. i dont know how much i paid and it was a drop ship. it makes me look like im not doing my job. and i have another business to run instead of making useless calls to see the job gets done when i should be able to do in 1 call or email and be done. the reason i was given, i will hold, i dont know if they would want their laundry out, but they had to change managers recently.

[TheRealWorld]

He feels that Roketa has done a good job for him, but he is mostly into scooters. He was going to order a 200 ATV for me and give me a very good price, but they could not ship any of the units I wanted, so I decided not to do it.

Thanks for the input on Zonshen, How does Walmart get all that stuff from China?

[phil]

buying from china is easier than you may think i have ordered a lot lately and have previously ordered a lot of bulk parts and its cheap if you could order in bulk, i cant. but if its a part and not something that epa,dot etc. has to check i contact the seller, make the order, western union a payment, and dhl drops it off in about 2 days. yes i was scared but i have a good source

[2LZ]

Originally Posted by phil

im also looking at a company called coolster and would like some input from you guys. but i think if i drop the zongs im out. in va you have to be a dealer to sell atvs, that means i have to have a franchise with a state approved motorcycle company and after all the trouble with the ones ive had i have to wonder

My local China bike guy just took on the Coolster quads a few months ago and so far, so good. Seem like nice little units and he's gotten what he's needed.

What confuses the heck out of me is all these bikes are all made out of mostly the same parts from the different Chinese factories making literal boatloads of this cloned stuff. Be it Zong, Lifan-type, Hensim or whatever. A lot of it is all the same. Why is it so hard to get support and parts????....at least compared to the Japanese, American and other manu's. These parts should be available everywhere at the rate they make and ship them.
My Hensim's even came with full breakdown manuals of every single part, with photos, with part #'s, for the bikes. You could literally build a brand new bike out of these parts catalogs.....but no one to call or contact.

I see so many exact parts between my Hensims and my new Lifan-type unit, it's mind boggling. 8O Why this stuff isn't available for immediate shipping with phone numbers and websites everywhere is beyond me.....unless it's our government locking up the works with their games.

I was in the mailing and shipping machine indusrty for almost two decades. Try dealing with Switzerland and Germany for parts and support.....but my clients were rarely down.

I just don't get it with the sheer volume that China produces and ships. Guess I haven't been in the China bike game long enough.....but I can say this. I'm not getting rid of them anytime soon! Best 'bang for the buck' I've bought in a very long time!

[TurboT]

I have thoughts on this matter but they might come out a bit ragged and jumbled.

I think part of the issue is the culture of the markets in Asia and in north america. North Americans wants after service, warranties etc. In Asia, you buy something in the store, walk out the door and you own it, don't want to see you again until you buy something NEW. Not a lot of 'after sale support' expected in their markets/culture.

Additionally, as Phil mentioned it's easy to buy things from China in 'container load' but no small business man wants to buy 2000 carbs or 1500 brake pads in a 20 ft container. Chinese factories don't want to sell you 10 carbs, they want to sell you 1000 minimum, so getting them to listen to your needs is like pulling teeth once they've made that container load sale.

I'm sure the US distributor of Zong is in the same boat. He wants to support his dealers but how do you buy 20,000 units of every part the bike has on it, you can't.. so when something 'obscure' happens, it's a beotch to get the factory to send you 1. It's a logistics problem for them, if they have to send small orders out all the time.

Wal-Mart has no problems because they buy 1 million units at a time. I had an order for 100,000 DVD players from wal-mart at one time in my life, and that's a small order as it was Canada only, for a three month period. They just 'exchange' any defects, and send them back or recycle them and deduct the warranty costs off the invoice to the factory.

[SpudRider]

Originally Posted by 2LZ

…What confuses the heck out of me is all these bikes are all made out of mostly the same parts from the different Chinese factories making literal boatloads of this cloned stuff. Be it Zong, Lifan-type, Hensim or whatever. A lot of it is all the same…

You make a good point, LZ. However, I would be remiss if I did not mention the Zong is different from the Lifan/Lifanoid bikes. Whereas the others are clones of older, Honda motorcycles, the Zongshen 200GY-2 is a clone of the current, Yamaha TW200 motorcycle.

Originally Posted by TurboT

...I'm sure the US distributor of Zong is in the same boat. He wants to support his dealers but how do you buy 20,000 units of every part the bike has on it, you can't.. so when something 'obscure' happens, it's a beotch to get the factory to send you 1. It's a logistics problem for them, if they have to send small orders out all the time…

You also make a very good point, Turbo. However, I do think Zong owners are fortunate that their motorcycles use parts from two, currently produced, Japanese motorcycles. The Zong engine, carburetor, airbox, and exhaust system parts can be replaced with currently produced Yamaha parts. In addition, the Zong rear hub and drum brake can be replaced with currently produced, Kawasaki parts.

Exactly for the reasons you stated, It can still be difficult to get some parts, e.g. plastic, for the Zong. However, virtually all of the main components of the Zong are compatible with other, currently produced, motorcycles. Therefore, in a pinch, Zong owners can still acquire other, albeit more expensive, Japanese parts for their bikes. However, I would still prefer to have good access to inexpensive, quality parts from Zongshen America. As with Phil, I still hope things will get rectified in Miami (Zongshen America Headquarters).

Spud

[phil]

supposedly they are trying to get everything fixed, so with luck i may staying with zong , time will tell. also it looks like i will also be going with coolster possibly modcycle and yanmar also may be living in a tent

[katoranger]

I can probably scratch a hut for you.

[TheRealWorld]

Phil, Can you tell us more about Yanmar?