X-Pect Backroad Development - Page 7

Thumper · 08-04-2022, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by China Rider 27

The team would like to thank the forum knowledge contributors as they were as much a part of this team and this bike build as anyone and without their contributions this bike would not be what it is today. This thread has been in large part an attempt to pay back a little something for the knowledge the Team acquired but it is nothing compared to what the Team received from others contributions.

The X-Pect is a well-made bike. It’s a tough bike. It is going to make a good Back Road Bike. I look forward to getting some seat time on the Back Road to see what she’s got. Here she is in her Back Road Glory! Goes by Jade! 2021 X-Pect B model; B stands for……….? LR version; LR stands for…………..?

Trivia answer: The Magician!!!!!

The CR27 Team is off to put on a handlebar, make other repairs and do maintenance, lick some wounds, and plan for the NEXT Back Road Ride Experience………………CG strong, Ride hard!

It looks perfect. It is a dirt bike. Dual sport, well, yes, but why bother with a dirtbike if you just drive on the road !!!

And by the way... If you aren't pushing your limits, you are just growing old(er)!!!!

Jwrider · 08-02-2022, 02:36 PM

I just got back from check ride with 16T front sprocket. With 15T @5k rpm 37mph. With 16T Was 40mph. Didn’t lose any noticeable low end. Still swear by rotella 4t15w40. Nice bike.

Jwrider · 08-04-2022, 12:14 PM

Does anyone know of a bolt on bash plate for Lifan x-pect 200. Thanks for info.

b3n · 01-04-2023, 10:33 AM

Great thread! As I was looking at the pictures, I had a feeling that I've seen this bike before, or something very similar to it.

One of my favorite bikes from my younger years that I could never afford back then, the Honda XR 125 L. That bike had the CG125 OHV engine but no fuel injection.
I think they were never sold in the US.

And compare the Lifan.

I think these are pretty much the same bike!

ProDigit · 07-19-2024, 10:56 PM

2.5 years later, and mine has arrived.
It's definitely been interesting to read up on all improvements suggestions.
The wheel ball bearings is interesting. I would probably pry the rubber gasket out of the wheel bearing, and add some grease to it.
The bearings aren't too expensive, and if they fail, can be replaced.

The airbox filter for us in Florida, makes no difference. The air here is clean.
I would definitely not seal up the airbox, or use a sponge intake. if anything, I would replace it with a pod filter, and get rid of the airbox; for the simple reason that if the fuel injection is based on the maf sensor, it might adjust the mapping depending on the intake airflow, but that's just presuming if it works like that.
If not, making it run only a bit leaner.
Changing the intake to a more free flow, like a pod filter, shouldn't change much on the ratio. Changing the exhaust may.
Sealing up the intake and using a sponge filter will only restrict airflow.
Maybe ok if you want to run a bit richer, but doesn't improve performance.

As far as gearing goes, I got a similar 18t (with 4mm spline width instead of 5mm), which I want to install. I just will have to file off the splines on the sprocket.
If not, I'll try to install a 34, 32, or 30t rear.
The engine got the power to push the bike to 70-75mph at much lower rpms.

China Rider 27 · 08-23-2024, 10:37 PM

While back a team member took a hard high side fall on an off-camber hard packed gravel road covered with pea to smaller gravel. The Rider had no serious injuries but pain is a harsh teacher and such lessons are not soon forgotten. The team was anxious to analyze and correct any issue that could be identified and solved which may have contributed to this fall.

The after-accident analysis would point most to operator error with speed and terrain adjustment errors as they came into the road at a 90 degree line of attack turning right off camber on a road sloping left close to 45 degrees away. A perfect scenario for a low side if you go not get the speed and angle right and if you correct to avoid then the high side will get you as it did in this instance. The ground is much further away on the high side of an off camber so you hit with more impact! I can say I have ridden the bike myself and it does appear the Trakmaster as used on this bike has a tendency to wash out on loose gravel. Is it any worse than any other tire that has a lateral paddle design? Hard to say but the small width and diameter of 70-100 19 does not help.

The Xpect comes stock with a 19 inch front tire that does not have any options for dirt style tires. The Team found that a HAWK 250 (carburetor model) 21 inch front rim assembly, this one made by X pro, fit perfectly on the Xpect and all that is required is swapping over the brake rotor. But what does this do to the height of the bike and handling?

Comparison of the Xpect 19 inch tire to the 21 inch Hawk tire.

The Team does like to analyze and they determined a 19 inch rim has a radius (distance from the center of a circle to the outer edge) of 9.5 inch. A 21-inch wheel rim has a radius of 10.5 inch or a difference of one inch. In other words, from the axle mounting point (center of the wheel) to the edge of the rim is 10.5 inches so adding a 21 inch wheel rim itself will raise the front end height by 1 inch.

Tire size factors in to create the overall height. So how tall the tire is plus the rim determines how much the overall height there will be. The height of the tread can also make a difference. Converting tire sizes to inches and considering only the rim and tire size the team found the following.

90/90-19 (stock) 9.5 for rim size plus 90/90 converted to 3.19 inch tire height = Overall height 12.69 inch

70/100-19 = -9.5 for rim size plus 70/100 converted to 2.76 inch tire height = Overall height 12.26 inch

80/100-21 = -10.5 for rim size plus 80/100 converted to 3.15 inch tire height = Overall height 13.64 inch

Adding the 80/100- 21 inch tire raised the height of the X pect a measured ½ inch at the pegs. The team decided to raise the front forks ¼ inch which lowers the front frame by ¼ inch. Team testing confirmed no issues with clearance and the result slowed down the steering and restricted the angle of approach much improving off-road handling performance.

Ranger Bob · 09-02-2024, 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by China Rider 27

While back a team member took a hard high side fall on an off-camber hard packed gravel road covered with pea to smaller gravel. The Rider had no serious injuries but pain is a harsh teacher and such lessons are not soon forgotten. The team was anxious to analyze and correct any issue that could be identified and solved which may have contributed to this fall.

The after-accident analysis would point most to operator error with speed and terrain adjustment errors as they came into the road at a 90 degree line of attack turning right off camber on a road sloping left close to 45 degrees away. A perfect scenario for a low side if you go not get the speed and angle right and if you correct to avoid then the high side will get you as it did in this instance. The ground is much further away on the high side of an off camber so you hit with more impact! I can say I have ridden the bike myself and it does appear the Trakmaster as used on this bike has a tendency to wash out on loose gravel. Is it any worse than any other tire that has a lateral paddle design? Hard to say but the small width and diameter of 70-100 19 does not help.

The Xpect comes stock with a 19 inch front tire that does not have any options for dirt style tires. The Team found that a HAWK 250 (carburetor model) 21 inch front rim assembly, this one made by X pro, fit perfectly on the Xpect and all that is required is swapping over the brake rotor. But what does this do to the height of the bike and handling?

Comparison of the Xpect 19 inch tire to the 21 inch Hawk tire.

The Team does like to analyze and they determined a 19 inch rim has a radius (distance from the center of a circle to the outer edge) of 9.5 inch. A 21-inch wheel rim has a radius of 10.5 inch or a difference of one inch. In other words, from the axle mounting point (center of the wheel) to the edge of the rim is 10.5 inches so adding a 21 inch wheel rim itself will raise the front end height by 1 inch.

Tire size factors in to create the overall height. So how tall the tire is plus the rim determines how much the overall height there will be. The height of the tread can also make a difference. Converting tire sizes to inches and considering only the rim and tire size the team found the following.

90/90-19 (stock) 9.5 for rim size plus 90/90 converted to 3.19 inch tire height = Overall height 12.69 inch

70/100-19 = -9.5 for rim size plus 70/100 converted to 2.76 inch tire height = Overall height 12.26 inch

80/100-21 = -10.5 for rim size plus 80/100 converted to 3.15 inch tire height = Overall height 13.64 inch

Adding the 80/100- 21 inch tire raised the height of the X pect a measured ½ inch at the pegs. The team decided to raise the front forks ¼ inch which lowers the front frame by ¼ inch. Team testing confirmed no issues with clearance and the result slowed down the steering and restricted the angle of approach much improving off-road handling performance.

Why not run a 100/90-19 K760 rear on the front? I'm pretty sure it would fit. Knobby tires aren't really directional. People that run big block tires on the road turn them around when they start to wear wonky. I don't think running a rear tire on the front at speeds under 60mph is an issue. I'll be buying an X-Pect soon and I think this would be the route I would take. Just thinking out loud...

Thumper · 08-24-2024, 07:55 AM

It sounds like you slipped the forks up in the triple clamp to effectively "shorten" the fork tubes. Yes, that should get the front steering angle (rake) more steep again, closer to stock. That larger front wheel should be easier to push through logs and taller bumps as well.
It's great that the front wheel from the Hawk fit the Expect, including the rotor. Sweet!

China Rider 27 · 10-13-2024, 10:51 PM

The shock the team used was a custom fabricated piece with some fitment issues.

The X pect rear shock dimensions are pretty close if not identical to the Hawk 250 shock in most respects, certainly in length, except for the shock eye diameter. The X Pect uses a 12mm diameter bolt and the Hawk a 10 mm diameter bolt.

The fix for this issue is using a 12mm to 10mm bushing to reduce the shock frame mounting holes to 10mm and then using a 10mm bolt and nut to fasten it in the frame. You may need to cut these to fit just inside the frame mounting holes so as to be able to tighten the shock. Is this the preferred method, probably not but fabrication is fundamental to the China Rider. The team likes to grease the inside and outside of bushings and the bolt except the socket engagement surfaces with a light coating of grease to reduce wear and prevent rust. The other critical measurement is the width of the shock eye and if it does not fit tight (space on either side of shock eye and the frame which allows the shock to slide back and forth horizontally) you may need to buy or fabricate bushings to take the play out. Another critical measurement is the overall width. To wide and it will rub on the airbox.

A shock with adjustable pre-load is what you obviously need. The forum has several discussions about shocks for the Hawk that you could search for and get some ideas. You already have the dimensions from above for comparisons.

Here is a link: https://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=23411

Here is an example of a shock that might work but check for yourself the measurements:

https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/A...im/refuge08-20

CG strong, Ride Hard!

ProDigit · 10-14-2024, 06:38 AM

There are roughly 1" taller tires on Amazon for sale for like $65.
It would correct the speedo.
Putting on 2" taller wheel/tires would possibly make the speedo underread.

China Rider 27 · 12-04-2021, 02:36 PM

China Rider 27 · 12-04-2021, 02:44 PM

There is a black box (fuel cell?) with two hoses coming into the top from the gas tank and the fuel pump is bolted the bottom with its electrical connector and the high-pressure fuel line to the fuel injector. Gas comes from the tank by way of the petcock into the black box, or fuel cell and is pressurized by the pump and transported to the injector. The Owner’s manual shows the fuel pump as part of the tank but that is obviously not the case. I am thinking the fuel flows from the tank by gravity and it is not pressurized but could be mistaken time will tell. The second hose line from the black box back to the fuel tank must be an unused fuel return line. There is no obvious filter for the fuel and a filter must be included as part of the fuel pump. If anyone has clarification, feel free to add a comment.

fuel cell

The fuel pump is marked with 250 KPa which translates into 36 psi.

Fuel Injector

The oxygen sensor with a thread diameter of 12mm. It has anti seize, I will spread it evenly or add more in case I need to remove it. Good function critical for EFI.

ECU - Troubleshooting the EFI, go to the Owners Manual, best place to start, has a troubleshooting section and fault codes. ECU will flash out trouble codes.

China Rider 27 · 12-04-2021, 03:03 PM

The Airbox is very well done! Stands out in comparison to others I have seen. It is three pieces, the box, a top lid with filter mount, and a filter cover. I was very please to see it seals tight with rubber gaskets at all connection points, the box cover, where the air filter fits on the bottom and the filter cover all have rubber gaskets. The box has two drain tubes on the bottom, one for the engine crankcase vent and the other for any liquid in the box itself sealed with plastic which will need checking periodically. The filter appears of good quality. Air tight box likely a requirement for EFI and pollution control. Good dust protection is an essential requirement for the backroad and no need to modify this box to make it so.

07-19-2024, 10:56 PM	#5
ProDigit Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: FL Posts: 357	2.5 years later, and mine has arrived. It's definitely been interesting to read up on all improvements suggestions. The wheel ball bearings is interesting. I would probably pry the rubber gasket out of the wheel bearing, and add some grease to it. The bearings aren't too expensive, and if they fail, can be replaced. The airbox filter for us in Florida, makes no difference. The air here is clean. I would definitely not seal up the airbox, or use a sponge intake. if anything, I would replace it with a pod filter, and get rid of the airbox; for the simple reason that if the fuel injection is based on the maf sensor, it might adjust the mapping depending on the intake airflow, but that's just presuming if it works like that. If not, making it run only a bit leaner. Changing the intake to a more free flow, like a pod filter, shouldn't change much on the ratio. Changing the exhaust may. Sealing up the intake and using a sponge filter will only restrict airflow. Maybe ok if you want to run a bit richer, but doesn't improve performance. As far as gearing goes, I got a similar 18t (with 4mm spline width instead of 5mm), which I want to install. I just will have to file off the splines on the sprocket. If not, I'll try to install a 34, 32, or 30t rear. The engine got the power to push the bike to 70-75mph at much lower rpms. __________________
	0

08-23-2024, 10:37 PM	#6
China Rider 27 Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: PNW Posts: 984	X Pect 21 inch tire While back a team member took a hard high side fall on an off-camber hard packed gravel road covered with pea to smaller gravel. The Rider had no serious injuries but pain is a harsh teacher and such lessons are not soon forgotten. The team was anxious to analyze and correct any issue that could be identified and solved which may have contributed to this fall. The after-accident analysis would point most to operator error with speed and terrain adjustment errors as they came into the road at a 90 degree line of attack turning right off camber on a road sloping left close to 45 degrees away. A perfect scenario for a low side if you go not get the speed and angle right and if you correct to avoid then the high side will get you as it did in this instance. The ground is much further away on the high side of an off camber so you hit with more impact! I can say I have ridden the bike myself and it does appear the Trakmaster as used on this bike has a tendency to wash out on loose gravel. Is it any worse than any other tire that has a lateral paddle design? Hard to say but the small width and diameter of 70-100 19 does not help. The Xpect comes stock with a 19 inch front tire that does not have any options for dirt style tires. The Team found that a HAWK 250 (carburetor model) 21 inch front rim assembly, this one made by X pro, fit perfectly on the Xpect and all that is required is swapping over the brake rotor. But what does this do to the height of the bike and handling? Comparison of the Xpect 19 inch tire to the 21 inch Hawk tire. The Team does like to analyze and they determined a 19 inch rim has a radius (distance from the center of a circle to the outer edge) of 9.5 inch. A 21-inch wheel rim has a radius of 10.5 inch or a difference of one inch. In other words, from the axle mounting point (center of the wheel) to the edge of the rim is 10.5 inches so adding a 21 inch wheel rim itself will raise the front end height by 1 inch. Tire size factors in to create the overall height. So how tall the tire is plus the rim determines how much the overall height there will be. The height of the tread can also make a difference. Converting tire sizes to inches and considering only the rim and tire size the team found the following. 90/90-19 (stock) 9.5 for rim size plus 90/90 converted to 3.19 inch tire height = Overall height 12.69 inch 70/100-19 = -9.5 for rim size plus 70/100 converted to 2.76 inch tire height = Overall height 12.26 inch 80/100-21 = -10.5 for rim size plus 80/100 converted to 3.15 inch tire height = Overall height 13.64 inch Adding the 80/100- 21 inch tire raised the height of the X pect a measured ½ inch at the pegs. The team decided to raise the front forks ¼ inch which lowers the front frame by ¼ inch. Team testing confirmed no issues with clearance and the result slowed down the steering and restricted the angle of approach much improving off-road handling performance.
	1

08-24-2024, 07:55 AM	#8
Thumper Join Date: Feb 2021 Location: Kansas City Posts: 2,682	It sounds like you slipped the forks up in the triple clamp to effectively "shorten" the fork tubes. Yes, that should get the front steering angle (rake) more steep again, closer to stock. That larger front wheel should be easier to push through logs and taller bumps as well. It's great that the front wheel from the Hawk fit the Expect, including the rotor. Sweet! __________________ No matter where you go, there you are
	2

10-13-2024, 10:51 PM	#9
China Rider 27 Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: PNW Posts: 984	The shock the team used was a custom fabricated piece with some fitment issues. The X pect rear shock dimensions are pretty close if not identical to the Hawk 250 shock in most respects, certainly in length, except for the shock eye diameter. The X Pect uses a 12mm diameter bolt and the Hawk a 10 mm diameter bolt. The fix for this issue is using a 12mm to 10mm bushing to reduce the shock frame mounting holes to 10mm and then using a 10mm bolt and nut to fasten it in the frame. You may need to cut these to fit just inside the frame mounting holes so as to be able to tighten the shock. Is this the preferred method, probably not but fabrication is fundamental to the China Rider. The team likes to grease the inside and outside of bushings and the bolt except the socket engagement surfaces with a light coating of grease to reduce wear and prevent rust. The other critical measurement is the width of the shock eye and if it does not fit tight (space on either side of shock eye and the frame which allows the shock to slide back and forth horizontally) you may need to buy or fabricate bushings to take the play out. Another critical measurement is the overall width. To wide and it will rub on the airbox. A shock with adjustable pre-load is what you obviously need. The forum has several discussions about shocks for the Hawk that you could search for and get some ideas. You already have the dimensions from above for comparisons. Here is a link: https://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=23411 Here is an example of a shock that might work but check for yourself the measurements: https://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/A...im/refuge08-20 CG strong, Ride Hard! Last edited by China Rider 27; 10-15-2024 at 09:26 AM. Reason: correction
	0

10-14-2024, 06:38 AM	#10
ProDigit Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: FL Posts: 357	There are roughly 1" taller tires on Amazon for sale for like $65. It would correct the speedo. Putting on 2" taller wheel/tires would possibly make the speedo underread. __________________
	0

08-02-2022, 02:36 PM	#2
Jwrider Join Date: Jul 2022 Posts: 26	I just got back from check ride with 16T front sprocket. With 15T @5k rpm 37mph. With 16T Was 40mph. Didn’t lose any noticeable low end. Still swear by rotella 4t15w40. Nice bike.
	0

08-04-2022, 12:14 PM	#3
Jwrider Join Date: Jul 2022 Posts: 26	Does anyone know of a bolt on bash plate for Lifan x-pect 200. Thanks for info.
	0

01-04-2023, 10:33 AM	#4
b3n Join Date: Dec 2022 Location: NH Posts: 10	Great thread! As I was looking at the pictures, I had a feeling that I've seen this bike before, or something very similar to it. One of my favorite bikes from my younger years that I could never afford back then, the Honda XR 125 L. That bike had the CG125 OHV engine but no fuel injection. I think they were never sold in the US. And compare the Lifan. I think these are pretty much the same bike!
	2

12-04-2021, 02:36 PM	#11
China Rider 27 Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: PNW Posts: 984	X-Pect wiring diagram
	1

12-04-2021, 02:44 PM	#12
China Rider 27 Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: PNW Posts: 984	X-Pect EFI fuel system and Oxygen sensor, ECU, Trouble codes, Owners Manual There is a black box (fuel cell?) with two hoses coming into the top from the gas tank and the fuel pump is bolted the bottom with its electrical connector and the high-pressure fuel line to the fuel injector. Gas comes from the tank by way of the petcock into the black box, or fuel cell and is pressurized by the pump and transported to the injector. The Owner’s manual shows the fuel pump as part of the tank but that is obviously not the case. I am thinking the fuel flows from the tank by gravity and it is not pressurized but could be mistaken time will tell. The second hose line from the black box back to the fuel tank must be an unused fuel return line. There is no obvious filter for the fuel and a filter must be included as part of the fuel pump. If anyone has clarification, feel free to add a comment. fuel cell The fuel pump is marked with 250 KPa which translates into 36 psi. Fuel Injector The oxygen sensor with a thread diameter of 12mm. It has anti seize, I will spread it evenly or add more in case I need to remove it. Good function critical for EFI. ECU - Troubleshooting the EFI, go to the Owners Manual, best place to start, has a troubleshooting section and fault codes. ECU will flash out trouble codes. Last edited by China Rider 27; 12-12-2021 at 10:29 PM.
	2

12-04-2021, 03:03 PM	#13
China Rider 27 Join Date: Dec 2018 Location: PNW Posts: 984	X-Pect Air Box The Airbox is very well done! Stands out in comparison to others I have seen. It is three pieces, the box, a top lid with filter mount, and a filter cover. I was very please to see it seals tight with rubber gaskets at all connection points, the box cover, where the air filter fits on the bottom and the filter cover all have rubber gaskets. The box has two drain tubes on the bottom, one for the engine crankcase vent and the other for any liquid in the box itself sealed with plastic which will need checking periodically. The filter appears of good quality. Air tight box likely a requirement for EFI and pollution control. Good dust protection is an essential requirement for the backroad and no need to modify this box to make it so.
	4