Close...but not quite

[Ski_rush]

Originally Posted by Landsvw

I saw a message concerning the CDI unit, AC or DC. But it’s now vanished. If I remember correctly, the units will have different plug-in connectors, and you will have to verify which type yours has to make sure what type of voltage it runs.

I Did a google search for ac/dc and found this:

“How to tell my style of CDI? (AC or DC)
Your CDI has two plugs, a 4-pin and a 2-pin. The 4-pin side may have 3 or 4 wires connected to it (both AC and DC versions). If the 2-pin connector has only 1 wire going to it, it's a DC CDI. If there are 2 wires attached to the 2-pin connector, then it's an AC CDI.

Note: A very few DC-powered CDI systems will have two wires on the two-pin connector. For these systems, please check to see if your headlights will work while the engine is not running, and if your stock CDI has "DC" printed anywhere on it. In these cases, you need a DC CDI.”

And, looking at the wiring diagram provided, that diagram, anyway, shows a DC CDI, Based on the rectifier converting the AC voltage from the stator to DC. So you have a DC CDI if that diagram is correct for your bike.

One of the very frustrating things about these bikes is that many questions can be answered with "it depends" and there are often no instructions or markings on anything. I watched this video on how to determine if you have a DC or AC CDI, click here for the video.

According to the video, I would have an AC CDI. My cdi is small and it has 2 wires on the 2 plug pin. However, from what you said, now it might be DC because my lights do indeed come on and work fine the the engine off...after all, that's all the engine has been...off. Lights, horn, blinkers work. So, you're saying that only a DC cdi would allow that and if I had an AC CDI the lights would not come on? I'm confused because according to the description in the video, my cdi would be AC.

And, no, there are absolutely no markings on the CDI. Would anything bad happen if I hooked up the wrong type of CDI by mistake?

Jerry, thanks for the link. That CDI will not work for my bike. If you look at the 2 plug side, the "house" for the terminal is square. My is rounded. From what I saw online, I need to ensure I get the rounded type.

So...I'm still confused with the AC vs. DC. If only they could have just marked the darn box...From the video, the cdi is AC, but according to what you're saying (the headlights do come on with the key on), then it's DC.

[JerryHawk250]

Originally Posted by Ski_rush

One of the very frustrating things about these bikes is that many questions can be answered with "it depends" and there are often no instructions or markings on anything. I watched this video on how to determine if you have a DC or AC CDI, click here for the video.

According to the video, I would have an AC CDI. My cdi is small and it has 2 wires on the 2 plug pin. However, from what you said, now it might be DC because my lights do indeed come on and work fine the the engine off...after all, that's all the engine has been...off. Lights, horn, blinkers work. So, you're saying that only a DC cdi would allow that and if I had an AC CDI the lights would not come on? I'm confused because according to the description in the video, my cdi would be AC.

And, no, there are absolutely no markings on the CDI. Would anything bad happen if I hooked up the wrong type of CDI by mistake?

Jerry, thanks for the link. That CDI will not work for my bike. If you look at the 2 plug side, the "house" for the terminal is square. My is rounded. From what I saw online, I need to ensure I get the rounded type.

So...I'm still confused with the AC vs. DC. If only they could have just marked the darn box...From the video, the cdi is AC, but according to what you're saying (the headlights do come on with the key on), then it's DC.

That's defiantly the wrong CDI I posted. You have an AC CDI.

[Douglass]

Is there a way to test the CDI, or other components to see if they are working? not sure if this makes a difference, but we tested the kill switch on Ski_Rush's bike using the multimeter testing in ohms when the kill switch is in the RUN position he is OL, and 0.000 when in KILL position. On my Apollo (dirt bike only version) it is the exact opposite.

[Ski_rush]

Ok, I watched this guys video on tests to perform when there's no spark. Here's the video I watched

[ ].

1. Test 1. Test battery. I get 13 volts.

2. Test 2. Ground spark plug to head and check for spark when cranking. Result = no spark. I tested this with 2 different plugs.


2. Test 3. Check Ohm reading at the ignition coil with leads touching the coil terminals. He gets a reading of 2.14. I get a reading of 0.000 (see pic below).




3. Test 4. Check Ohm of ignition coil a different way, this time with one lead at the spark plug boot. He gets a reading of 2.14. I get a reading of 8.80 (see pic).





4. Test 5. Test the solenoid. He tests the solenoid volts with positive to positive and negative to negative and gets a reading of 12.88V. I did the same and got 13v (see pic Test 5).



Then, he switches the leads and checks if current will flow when the engine cranks. He gets a reading of 12.88v, meaning that current is flowing as it should.

When I did this (with the leads switched at the solenoid) I get -12v sitting and here's the result while cranking:

.

5. He didn't do a true CDI test. All he does is swap the CDI for a spare one and then tries to start it. I don't have a spare CDI and was hoping to see a way to test the CDI.

6. The last test he does with with the Stator. I removed the cover that covers the front sprocket. That's where the wires from the stator go. It is way too tight and tucked in to remove. I don't think I'd be able to remove those from the terminal with damaging it. I didn't test the stator.

[Megadan]

I wont be much more help than these guys have already been, but I suspect the coil personally. You arent too far away from me and I converted my Hawk to coil on plug. You are welcome to have my coil to test it out. If you are going to be in Omaha you can swing by and get it, or I can bring it to you sometime this week, Tuesday or wednesday.

[Ski_rush]

Originally Posted by Megadan

I wont be much more help than these guys have already been, but I suspect the coil personally. You arent too far away from me and I converted my Hawk to coil on plug. You are welcome to have my coil to test it out. If you are going to be in Omaha you can swing by and get it, or I can bring it to you sometime this week, Tuesday or wednesday.

Thanks Dan. I'm free on Tuesday and Wednesday. And, I can meet you in Sioux City, IA. Seems like that would be a better place to meet up in terms of the roads and it saves you some time. I would be very very appreciative if you can loan me a coil to test it out.

Please let me know.

dj

[JerryHawk250]

One thing about this group is we are not going to give up until you get her running.

[Douglass]

Can anyone confirm if the wires coming from the Stator plug directly into the CDI? I would like to check the ohms, and also check to see if there is a pules from the stator to the CDI.

If the stator does not plug directly to the CDI, what would I be looking for?

[Douglass]

The blue with white tracer goes from stater to CDI.

Is this considered the trigger wire that would activate the CDI to send spark to the coil? If so, would I just hook the Positive multimeter lead to the blue/white wire, and ground the Black Mutlimeter lead to the chassis?

When testing do I leave it the connector plugged into the CDI, or unplug it?

[Bruces]

My eyes are horrible ,but from what I can make out on the above wiring diagram ,the cdi is wired green for ground ,b/w is engine kill and ignition switch ,l/w is trigger from stator ,b/y cdi output to ignition coil ,and b is 12 volt power .Squinting with my glasses off staring at my iPad so I might have some of the letters not quite correct l.o.l. .
Hope it helps .

[Ski_rush]

The other problem is that if I do test the stator, I don’t see a disconnect terminal. On the videos I’ve seen online, the guys simply disconnect wires at a terminal connection point. I do not see that on this bike.

[Weazler]

You don't always need to disconnect things or have direct access to a terminal to test them. You can tape a sewing needle to your multi-meter probe and poke into the wire to test it. This isn't the greatest for specific readings, but if you're simply trying to see if its putting out a signal, it works.

I mostly skimmed this thread, but it seems like you're on the right track. the kill switch works, the grounds seem functional (though cleaning off the paint where they mount to the chassis could be a huge help) and you get questionable readings from the CDI and coil. I really think you should swap out the coil with another one and see what happens. A lot of Automotive service manuals use the term "check with known good part" in their diagnostics fields.

[Weazler]

I've seen in many cases, working on cars, where i get somewhat normal readings when testing a part that ended up fixing the issue when swapped with a known good unit. But typically you find the issue (in this case no spark) and trace it from start to finish. So from stator to plug (from what Ive gathered) and every component in between.

[Bruces]

Originally Posted by Ski_rush

The other problem is that if I do test the stator, I don’t see a disconnect terminal. On the videos I’ve seen online, the guys simply disconnect wires at a terminal connection point. I do not see that on this bike.

Watching this video ,it appears the connection for the stator is close to the top of the battery ,just follow the wires and you will find it .

[paulsstag]

Originally Posted by Weazler

I've seen in many cases, working on cars, where i get somewhat normal readings when testing a part that ended up fixing the issue when swapped with a known good unit. But typically you find the issue (in this case no spark) and trace it from start to finish. So from stator to plug (from what Ive gathered) and every component in between.

This may or may not help but i'll put it out there anyway. Years ago i had a tt600 yamaha that lost spark and i spent many hours trying to figure it out. It was not until a friend showed up with the factory workshop manual and a decent multi-meter to check everything out. He did every test in the book and at the end of passing all the tests it says " if your yamaha has correct readings in all tests then replace the cdi unit as there is no test for the cdi unit" ordered a new one and that was it.

Years latter i worked at a motorcycle/atv store and the test procedures are almost always the same with the test ending with if all checks are good then replace the cdi unit.

The good news about this was because i had to think my way through the problem solving part ( even though i was very frustrated at the time ) i have learnt valuable lessons and feel i am better at diagnosing most things from the lessons of 30 years ago.

Keep a good attitude and learn from these trouble times. Also it may be prudent to purchase a spare cdi and ign coil to keep as a back up seeing as many here have had cdi box trouble and generally carry one spare on the bike ( i would include a spare spark plug to carry with you as well)

See if the people you bought the bike from will send you a cdi and ign coil under warranty , is at least worth an ask.

Best of luck to you .
Paul