new tire time -TT250 - Page 4

Thumper · 04-03-2023, 10:16 AM

Overfilling can help coax it up against the bead. I have transiently gone over 100psi. Sounds scary, but the tire can handle the pressure. Obviously, don't leave it at that pressure! Watch that area in question while you overfill it. If it moves out, you should be able to observe it happening. There is a possibility that the tire is not cast straight, and the line near the bead is uneven, but this is unlikely. Shinkos are generally good tires.

One last thing... With the wheel suspended, spin it and see if the tread wobbles near that placed where the bead appears to be "not" up to the bead.

And yes, you were right to empty it let the tube straighten out. It is about all you can do once the tire is on there.

flopsweat · 04-04-2023, 08:50 PM

Boo. I pulled out the tube, it was indeed a little damp inside, dried the tire with a hair dryer, dried the tube, powdered it well, put it back in, it slid around nicely this time, muscled it back on, filled it up, and the same result.

What's super weird is even when deflated, it still looks the the same. Kinda off center. And when it was on the axle it definitely had a big wobble to it so it's for sure not on the rim straight. Even went up to 45psi again. Gah. Campin' trip coming up in a week and a half, and wondering if I should give in and take it to my mechanic, he might be able to pop it off and tell if something is off within 10min.

XLsior · 04-04-2023, 09:17 PM

You might need to tune your spokes if the rim is out of round...

you can use some wire around the shock with an end close to the rim free spin the wheel and see of the gap between the end of the wire and the rim changes on any axis.

learning how tweak spokes takes a bit of counter intuitiveness as sometimes you need to tighten/loosen the spoke nut on the oposite side and diameter of the wheel to make the adjustment required...

First check though is to make sure the spokes are tight to begin with...

Which is easy enough buy playing them with the handle of a screwdriver/wrench..

they should all sound taught with a plink sound...

Any dull thunk sounds means that spoke is loose.

flopsweat · 04-04-2023, 10:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XLsior

You might need to tune your spokes if the rim is out of round...

you can use some wire around the shock with an end close to the rim free spin the wheel and see of the gap between the end of the wire and the rim changes on any axis.

learning how tweak spokes takes a bit of counter intuitiveness as sometimes you need to tighten/loosen the spoke nut on the oposite side and diameter of the wheel to make the adjustment required...

First check though is to make sure the spokes are tight to begin with...

Which is easy enough buy playing them with the handle of a screwdriver/wrench..

they should all sound taught with a plink sound...

Any dull thunk sounds means that spoke is loose.

Ooooh that might be it, I just went out there and a bunch of them are thunking or buzzing. This is something I actually check monthly, so maybe when I was wrenching the crap out of this first one during the first few frustrating hours, I wobbled it out of whack. The wheel is already in my car so I'll check it over at work tomorrow.

Update: They seem tight-ish I suppose, some are a little higher pitched than others, but none feel super loose. I hope they just need adjustment, time to start diving into those videos now. I mean there's three variables; tube, tire, rim. One would assume a Shinko doesn't have a major defect, the tube *seems* to look fine, which leaves the rim.

A dirt bike guy told me the bead may have deformed a little while wrestling with it, and to try inflating while using soapy water just on the side that needs to come out, and sort of whack the tire with a rubber mallet away from the rim to try and pull the bead into place, and that riding on it may help. It for sure has some lateral / up-n-down runout when it's on the axle, but I didn't pull the tire fully off again to confirm if the rim itself does. I like XLsior's idea of using a heavy wire wrapped around a fork to see how straight the rim is.

flopsweat · 04-07-2023, 10:06 AM

Whelp, I tried a few different things, ended up putting the old tube and old tire back on the rim, and ended with the same result. So looking at my rim, that boy ain't right. I'm giving up and taking the wheel in somewhere this weekend to get finished. Too much messing around and it's going to be stellar outside all next week.

Final update until it's complete: Took it in, the rim is officially pretty out of whack, and would cost equal to or more than the cost of a brand new rim from CSC ($129). SO... that's getting ordered in a few minutes. The end of my drama is near, and I just must be too darn strong and need to tone it down a few notches. My sheer muscle mass must have ripped apart this ultra-strong performance stock rim...

flopsweat · 04-19-2023, 05:21 PM

Forgot to post, but I finally did it. The tire finally looked quite centered on the rim, put it back on the axle... and it looks a LITTLE better than the video, but still not perfect. Then I realized I never tried this on the original wheel, knowing that these tolerances aren't going to be super tight. Gave it a ride, and it felt fine.

I went on an overnight camping trip this past weekend, and of course, started noticing during the 6hrs of riding that it felt a little bumpy. The roads aren't great so it was tough to tell, but for sure, if I sigh during a 50mph stretch of flat road, my voice is going "uhhh-uhhh-uhhh-uhhh-uhhh" from the front wheel.

Not quite sure what I want to do from here. I've taken that new tire on/off a dozen times by now and don't know if all the wrenching was enough to screw up the bead. The new rim might not be true, as the packaging in the box was pretty cruddy and it was flopping around inside. Should I just buy a truing stand for $50, take the tire off AGAIN, and give it my best shot to line that thing up as best possible? Ugh, this is all my fault for not just having someone else do the tires.

04-03-2023, 10:16 AM	#46
Thumper Join Date: Feb 2021 Location: Kansas City Posts: 2,427	Overfilling can help coax it up against the bead. I have transiently gone over 100psi. Sounds scary, but the tire can handle the pressure. Obviously, don't leave it at that pressure! Watch that area in question while you overfill it. If it moves out, you should be able to observe it happening. There is a possibility that the tire is not cast straight, and the line near the bead is uneven, but this is unlikely. Shinkos are generally good tires. One last thing... With the wheel suspended, spin it and see if the tread wobbles near that placed where the bead appears to be "not" up to the bead. And yes, you were right to empty it let the tube straighten out. It is about all you can do once the tire is on there. __________________ -2022 5 speed Templar X Orange, OEM 51T rear sprocket, 14T front sprocket -NOS 2020 KTM 250SX (2-stroke motocross), less than 10 hours on it
	1

04-07-2023, 10:06 AM	#50
flopsweat Join Date: Oct 2021 Location: The burbs of Chicago Posts: 237	Whelp, I tried a few different things, ended up putting the old tube and old tire back on the rim, and ended with the same result. So looking at my rim, that boy ain't right. I'm giving up and taking the wheel in somewhere this weekend to get finished. Too much messing around and it's going to be stellar outside all next week. Final update until it's complete: Took it in, the rim is officially pretty out of whack, and would cost equal to or more than the cost of a brand new rim from CSC ($129). SO... that's getting ordered in a few minutes. The end of my drama is near, and I just must be too darn strong and need to tone it down a few notches. My sheer muscle mass must have ripped apart this ultra-strong performance stock rim... Last edited by flopsweat; 04-07-2023 at 02:58 PM. Reason: update
	0

04-04-2023, 08:50 PM	#47
flopsweat Join Date: Oct 2021 Location: The burbs of Chicago Posts: 237	Boo. I pulled out the tube, it was indeed a little damp inside, dried the tire with a hair dryer, dried the tube, powdered it well, put it back in, it slid around nicely this time, muscled it back on, filled it up, and the same result. What's super weird is even when deflated, it still looks the the same. Kinda off center. And when it was on the axle it definitely had a big wobble to it so it's for sure not on the rim straight. Even went up to 45psi again. Gah. Campin' trip coming up in a week and a half, and wondering if I should give in and take it to my mechanic, he might be able to pop it off and tell if something is off within 10min.
	0

04-04-2023, 09:17 PM	#48
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,327	You might need to tune your spokes if the rim is out of round... you can use some wire around the shock with an end close to the rim free spin the wheel and see of the gap between the end of the wire and the rim changes on any axis. learning how tweak spokes takes a bit of counter intuitiveness as sometimes you need to tighten/loosen the spoke nut on the oposite side and diameter of the wheel to make the adjustment required... First check though is to make sure the spokes are tight to begin with... Which is easy enough buy playing them with the handle of a screwdriver/wrench.. they should all sound taught with a plink sound... Any dull thunk sounds means that spoke is loose.
	1

04-19-2023, 05:21 PM	#51
flopsweat Join Date: Oct 2021 Location: The burbs of Chicago Posts: 237	Forgot to post, but I finally did it. The tire finally looked quite centered on the rim, put it back on the axle... and it looks a LITTLE better than the video, but still not perfect. Then I realized I never tried this on the original wheel, knowing that these tolerances aren't going to be super tight. Gave it a ride, and it felt fine. I went on an overnight camping trip this past weekend, and of course, started noticing during the 6hrs of riding that it felt a little bumpy. The roads aren't great so it was tough to tell, but for sure, if I sigh during a 50mph stretch of flat road, my voice is going "uhhh-uhhh-uhhh-uhhh-uhhh" from the front wheel. Not quite sure what I want to do from here. I've taken that new tire on/off a dozen times by now and don't know if all the wrenching was enough to screw up the bead. The new rim might not be true, as the packaging in the box was pretty cruddy and it was flopping around inside. Should I just buy a truing stand for $50, take the tire off AGAIN, and give it my best shot to line that thing up as best possible? Ugh, this is all my fault for not just having someone else do the tires.
	0