Project XL185/CG250 swap - Page 25

XLsior · 09-09-2023, 04:45 PM

My only explanation is the BOAO dished piston has increased combustion chamber volume so more air needs more fuel with curve demanding more at WOT high rpm...

I'm a little shocked too but that's what the spark plug and bikes running behavior is telling me to do...

I think my other big bore was a 42/135?/3rdclip before it ate itself...

Stock piston 40/130/3rd clip.

Looking at the Nibbi PE28 specs a 150 main jet is already maximum listed tuning specification.

The only other possibility is an inlet manifold leak that develops at WOT the O'ring looks ok though but I might change it if the 152 does not make the stumble go away...the inlet manifold was modified and outsourced alloy welded but I did have to use JB weld to seal some pinholes come to think of it...

XLsior · 09-09-2023, 08:27 PM

Perhaps its a top end phat bog all along...

Sprayed carb cleaner around the manifold with no noticeable change...

I tried the 152...definitely a bit doughy now...I think the pilot and needle is correct for 4/5th of the throttle range...

My overly lean condition was down low from the outset perhaps..?

Checking the plug now is still tanish and can't hold WOT to effect the plug...

So where to try the main jetting from...perhaps back into the mid 130's

XLsior · 09-09-2023, 09:33 PM

135 main...did a full local loop hit 65mph WOT with 1 little hiccup hitting RPM limit...

Definitive result...Also I think my previous flood out experience might have just been a kill switch nudge...

Plug isn't white now but some ash grey...So going to try a 138main...

XLsior · 09-12-2023, 09:22 PM

138main...back to WOT bog above 7k RPM.

Needle clip position testing. heading leaner from 4th to 2nd. If that does not work then the 135 so far is the closest to optimal with only the 5th richest needle position to fall back on.

Though from what I understand needle clip is mid range tuning... So if the 135 main is close to optimal at WOT and the 138 behaves rich again then only a jet a fraction higher or perhaps lower than 135 will be the perfect oatmeal...

unfortunately I do not have any jets in between 130-135-138.

So it seems 135 with clip testing is all that remains in my tuning range.

XLsior · 09-13-2023, 12:47 AM

Needle clip testing is indicating the 4th clip is optimal across the mid range.
might try to find some 133/136 main jets but from all the configurations and over rich main jet bog mistakes at WOT. 42pilot 135main on 4th clip is about as close to dialed in as I can get with a 4*advance key and BOAO big bore kit.

XLsior · 10-08-2023, 02:04 AM

My exhaust was popping off and not in a good way.

The attempts of using mountain bike seat clamps would inevitably vibrate loose...tried all matter of things to make it work like extra nuts and shims but I've experienced to many pop offs now that its becoming a possible risk.

So I found an old couch seat spring and some cup holder hooks and adopted the spring hanger method...

It can wiggle around and heat expand now with unlikely chance of pop'n'flop.

Also by removing the clamp i gained enough clearance to run the side luggage racks inboard again so slimmed in the profile aka less wide hips

XLsior · 10-15-2023, 01:21 AM

Went for a local loop...exhaust held up with no more detachment concerns.
hit the 100kph/65mph straight and got the stumble/fishbites at WOT again.

135main jet in early summer heat air temps seems to behave rich again at WOT.

Still waiting on the 133main jet to arrive but there's not much adjustment left between 130-135.

XLsior · 10-20-2023, 06:57 PM

Go figure...

Went for a Saturday morning jaunt thinking that XLsior (the bikes name not mine) won't let me down on such a nice day...

Well Murphy's law had other plans.

about halfway my exhaust suddenly became a lot louder but my complacent thinking told my brain that there was no possible way it could have come loose after all that went into fixing the slip join...

I get to my halfway destination and park the bike...

Look at where the muffler is supposed to be and it was vamoose.

So closer inspection under the guard leads to a snapped header pipe...

Which implies the muffler hanger bolt came loose and fell out and road bumps found the weak point...(Probably 1 of my welds)

I'm think the days of Aussie muffler might be over for this bike...Well that's what the bike is trying to tell me it seems...

On way back trying not to wake everyone with open header pipe pop-bangs I found the ejected muffler can with the springs still attached and a few deep road scuffs..

Road rest of the way home with tail tucked between legs...

think i'll be looking for a stainless steel complete exhaust package with Aussie muffler going towards the 81 poochie project.

XLsior · 11-11-2023, 12:06 AM

So to try and cut a long story short in bullet point point form.

Drove van to get hardware supplies...

Van starts surging and manages to make it home and konks out...

Replace fuel filter...still cuts out with splutters...

Replace injectors...still konks out...

Likely culprit mechanical diesel injection pump...aka expensive PITA.

OK Van is out of action....again.

Meanwhile using the purchased hardware to make new beehives...

Shifting beehives around and my lower back tweaks out /pinched sciatic nerve...after `a few days of low mobility> pain is now spread to right side hip and down leg. So less mobile. This is mainly due to a dicky spinal disk that decides to slip out when it feels the urge to do so...

So now my Van is immobile and so am I...

But at some point I'll need to leave the house.

So fixing the busted muffler on the bike is now top priority...

I ordered a stainless steel exhaust kit (ebay) but what was sent did not match the product image...so it was returned and refunded..

But Van injector pump fix is likely a $1500 rebuild...Funds are squeaky tight now...

So the Aussie muffler is going back on.

removed the cheap glass wrap which I will never do again...horrible stuff.

Repaired some new and old cracks in the pipe...

Fresh coat of high temp paint...

Added a lock nut so if the muffler falls off now i'll take is as a sign to save up for a CF Moto 450 MT. (that's probably going to happen regardless)

Xlsior is back to before now...still waiting on that 133 main jet kit...

maybe that's a short story made long... But can't do much other than lying down or sitting still for now...

XLsior · 12-21-2023, 03:52 AM

So about 5+ weeks of sciatic back pain recovery later, With the muffler repaired it was finally time to see if 2 wheeling mobilty was possible...

I had a mission to collect some new Aquarium/Aquaponic system fish

10 texas cichlids, Herichthys cyanoguttatus Somewhat of a potential pest but I want to be able to breed and self stock my own food fish....I digress

Any way Got the bike running and had a about a 1hr return trip to achieve.

Yes I still have back pain but its 'tolerable'

Down the hill to the fuel station for a fill up of fresh gogo juice...

6.7lt topped up...checked trip 135km or about 5l per 100km which is 47mpg...however was pulling a lot of oversized main jet testing so I would say this result is worst case scenario...Also not sure how accurate my ODO is... Its my first benchmark fuel economy number...

Got to the Fish Store...collected order, stowed in back pack and made the return trip...

Bike performed fine though I never poked WOT due to still waiting for the 132-134 main jets...135 is still rich...

Got home No drama...

Back hurts a little afterwards but its doable...

outcome...Fish got

XLsior · 01-04-2024, 05:08 AM

Another fuel stop topup. 5l per 120km. or 4.17l per 100km = 56.4 US MPG.

I've finally got the 132 and 134 main jets from Ali.

I might go back to 40 pilot from 42 and 132 main from 135..keeping the needle. on 4th clip.

Idle tends to move about a bit so maybe the pilot is a tad large with the AF screw trying to dance around atmosphere air parameters and engine temp. constantly need to make on the fly idle tweaks.

Current jetting is getting me around ok ...but its not quite in the sweet spot...

Havn't checked the plug for awhile either but I doubt its lean...

2LZ · 01-04-2024, 11:45 AM

Try moving the needle to the third (middle?) and dropping it a tad more into the bore. This will let you know if it's pilot or emulsion tube responding the needle shoulder shape. Quick and easy test.

I have had zero luck with aquariums. I discovered never put a crab in with glass fish unless you like floating, empty carcass.

XLsior · 01-04-2024, 05:59 PM

I had to move the needle from the middle to the 4th /richer needle clip. middle clip was too lean. already did needle testing.

most of the issue now is idle (closed throttle) and WOT...the mid range is ok.

This is all after I installed the 70mm big bore kit.

stock config was 38p 130m mid clip 3rd position. perfect plug read.

XLsior · 01-05-2024, 01:25 AM

So I inspected the plug after my 2 economy runs without WOT.

It still appears to be close to lean, as in ash gray but no real brown tinge.

I have decided to up the pilot to 45 from 42 and dropped the main from 135 to 132.

needle still in 4th position. A/F was between 2 and 2.5 turns out.

the ebay Xring chain has stretched with break in slack so have decided to up tooth the front sprocket gain from 16 to 17 with the 44 rear.

While taking off the sprocket cover the oil cooler sump adapter appears to be a leak point...I will either add thread tape or sealant as the oring does not appear to seat with the intake and outlet banjo bolts in the correct position and cant make another half or full turn to snug up...

XLsior · 01-06-2024, 08:01 PM

Ok so rain stopped and roads dried up for a Sunday loop...

17F-44R was fine.. Manged about 50mph in 5th gear on a 45* incline.

As for the carb tuning...well its seems the 132 is perhaps still to big and or the 4th clip is now out of whack with the bigger 45 pilot jet...

I get fish biting about 7000rpm WOT on the flat... and if a sharply back off there is a bog sometimes...

But decel popping has subsided under engine braking So I think the 45 pilot is correct.

Which suffice to say suggest its either the clip now to rich and needs to go back to the middle 3rd position...

Or my time waiting for the 132-134 main jets was a waste because 130 or less is required for WOT...

As I have basically gone down the Main jets from 150 all the back to 130 with the same WOT lurch symptom.

I will try 3rd clip with current 45/132 as I CBF servicing the carb right now.

Dr Appointment in Tuesday in regards to back/sciatic issues, So no major bike overhauls till after...

09-09-2023, 04:45 PM	#1
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	My only explanation is the BOAO dished piston has increased combustion chamber volume so more air needs more fuel with curve demanding more at WOT high rpm... I'm a little shocked too but that's what the spark plug and bikes running behavior is telling me to do... I think my other big bore was a 42/135?/3rdclip before it ate itself... Stock piston 40/130/3rd clip. Looking at the Nibbi PE28 specs a 150 main jet is already maximum listed tuning specification. The only other possibility is an inlet manifold leak that develops at WOT the O'ring looks ok though but I might change it if the 152 does not make the stumble go away...the inlet manifold was modified and outsourced alloy welded but I did have to use JB weld to seal some pinholes come to think of it... Last edited by XLsior; 09-09-2023 at 08:27 PM.
	0

09-09-2023, 09:33 PM	#3
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	135 main...did a full local loop hit 65mph WOT with 1 little hiccup hitting RPM limit... Definitive result...Also I think my previous flood out experience might have just been a kill switch nudge... Plug isn't white now but some ash grey...So going to try a 138main... Last edited by XLsior; 09-10-2023 at 12:56 AM.
	0

09-12-2023, 09:22 PM	#4
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	138main...back to WOT bog above 7k RPM. Needle clip position testing. heading leaner from 4th to 2nd. If that does not work then the 135 so far is the closest to optimal with only the 5th richest needle position to fall back on. Though from what I understand needle clip is mid range tuning... So if the 135 main is close to optimal at WOT and the 138 behaves rich again then only a jet a fraction higher or perhaps lower than 135 will be the perfect oatmeal... unfortunately I do not have any jets in between 130-135-138. So it seems 135 with clip testing is all that remains in my tuning range. Last edited by XLsior; 09-12-2023 at 11:11 PM.
	1

10-08-2023, 02:04 AM	#6
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	More exhaust pipe modification My exhaust was popping off and not in a good way. The attempts of using mountain bike seat clamps would inevitably vibrate loose...tried all matter of things to make it work like extra nuts and shims but I've experienced to many pop offs now that its becoming a possible risk. So I found an old couch seat spring and some cup holder hooks and adopted the spring hanger method... It can wiggle around and heat expand now with unlikely chance of pop'n'flop. Also by removing the clamp i gained enough clearance to run the side luggage racks inboard again so slimmed in the profile aka less wide hips Attached Thumbnails
	0

10-20-2023, 06:57 PM	#8
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Here's Me thinking All was fixed... Go figure... Went for a Saturday morning jaunt thinking that XLsior (the bikes name not mine) won't let me down on such a nice day... Well Murphy's law had other plans. about halfway my exhaust suddenly became a lot louder but my complacent thinking told my brain that there was no possible way it could have come loose after all that went into fixing the slip join... I get to my halfway destination and park the bike... Look at where the muffler is supposed to be and it was vamoose. So closer inspection under the guard leads to a snapped header pipe... Which implies the muffler hanger bolt came loose and fell out and road bumps found the weak point...(Probably 1 of my welds) I'm think the days of Aussie muffler might be over for this bike...Well that's what the bike is trying to tell me it seems... On way back trying not to wake everyone with open header pipe pop-bangs I found the ejected muffler can with the springs still attached and a few deep road scuffs.. Road rest of the way home with tail tucked between legs... think i'll be looking for a stainless steel complete exhaust package with Aussie muffler going towards the 81 poochie project. Attached Thumbnails
	0

09-09-2023, 08:27 PM	#2
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Perhaps its a top end phat bog all along... Sprayed carb cleaner around the manifold with no noticeable change... I tried the 152...definitely a bit doughy now...I think the pilot and needle is correct for 4/5th of the throttle range... My overly lean condition was down low from the outset perhaps..? Checking the plug now is still tanish and can't hold WOT to effect the plug... So where to try the main jetting from...perhaps back into the mid 130's
	0

09-13-2023, 12:47 AM	#5
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Needle clip testing is indicating the 4th clip is optimal across the mid range. might try to find some 133/136 main jets but from all the configurations and over rich main jet bog mistakes at WOT. 42pilot 135main on 4th clip is about as close to dialed in as I can get with a 4*advance key and BOAO big bore kit.
	1

10-15-2023, 01:21 AM	#7
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Went for a local loop...exhaust held up with no more detachment concerns. hit the 100kph/65mph straight and got the stumble/fishbites at WOT again. 135main jet in early summer heat air temps seems to behave rich again at WOT. Still waiting on the 133main jet to arrive but there's not much adjustment left between 130-135.
	1

11-11-2023, 12:06 AM	#9
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Tweaked Back and Aussie Muff repair. So to try and cut a long story short in bullet point point form. Drove van to get hardware supplies... Van starts surging and manages to make it home and konks out... Replace fuel filter...still cuts out with splutters... Replace injectors...still konks out... Likely culprit mechanical diesel injection pump...aka expensive PITA. OK Van is out of action....again. Meanwhile using the purchased hardware to make new beehives... Shifting beehives around and my lower back tweaks out /pinched sciatic nerve...after `a few days of low mobility> pain is now spread to right side hip and down leg. So less mobile. This is mainly due to a dicky spinal disk that decides to slip out when it feels the urge to do so... So now my Van is immobile and so am I... But at some point I'll need to leave the house. So fixing the busted muffler on the bike is now top priority... I ordered a stainless steel exhaust kit (ebay) but what was sent did not match the product image...so it was returned and refunded.. But Van injector pump fix is likely a $1500 rebuild...Funds are squeaky tight now... So the Aussie muffler is going back on. removed the cheap glass wrap which I will never do again...horrible stuff. Repaired some new and old cracks in the pipe... Fresh coat of high temp paint... Added a lock nut so if the muffler falls off now i'll take is as a sign to save up for a CF Moto 450 MT. (that's probably going to happen regardless) Xlsior is back to before now...still waiting on that 133 main jet kit... maybe that's a short story made long... But can't do much other than lying down or sitting still for now... Attached Thumbnails
	1

12-21-2023, 03:52 AM	#10
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	So about 5+ weeks of sciatic back pain recovery later, With the muffler repaired it was finally time to see if 2 wheeling mobilty was possible... I had a mission to collect some new Aquarium/Aquaponic system fish 10 texas cichlids, Herichthys cyanoguttatus Somewhat of a potential pest but I want to be able to breed and self stock my own food fish....I digress Any way Got the bike running and had a about a 1hr return trip to achieve. Yes I still have back pain but its 'tolerable' Down the hill to the fuel station for a fill up of fresh gogo juice... 6.7lt topped up...checked trip 135km or about 5l per 100km which is 47mpg...however was pulling a lot of oversized main jet testing so I would say this result is worst case scenario...Also not sure how accurate my ODO is... Its my first benchmark fuel economy number... Got to the Fish Store...collected order, stowed in back pack and made the return trip... Bike performed fine though I never poked WOT due to still waiting for the 132-134 main jets...135 is still rich... Got home No drama... Back hurts a little afterwards but its doable... outcome...Fish got Attached Thumbnails
	2

01-04-2024, 05:08 AM	#11
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Another fuel stop topup. 5l per 120km. or 4.17l per 100km = 56.4 US MPG. I've finally got the 132 and 134 main jets from Ali. I might go back to 40 pilot from 42 and 132 main from 135..keeping the needle. on 4th clip. Idle tends to move about a bit so maybe the pilot is a tad large with the AF screw trying to dance around atmosphere air parameters and engine temp. constantly need to make on the fly idle tweaks. Current jetting is getting me around ok ...but its not quite in the sweet spot... Havn't checked the plug for awhile either but I doubt its lean...
	1

01-04-2024, 11:45 AM	#12
2LZ Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Volcano, Ca Posts: 7,106	Try moving the needle to the third (middle?) and dropping it a tad more into the bore. This will let you know if it's pilot or emulsion tube responding the needle shoulder shape. Quick and easy test. I have had zero luck with aquariums. I discovered never put a crab in with glass fish unless you like floating, empty carcass. __________________ "Light a fire for a man, and you heat him for a day. Light a man on fire, and you heat him for the rest of his life." 2007 Suzuki DRZ400S (SM convert) 2009 Q Link XP 200 1967 BSA B25 250cc Starfire 2022 Royal Enfield Interceptor 650 2023 Royal Enfield Scram 411 1948 Royal Enfield Model G 350
	0

01-04-2024, 05:59 PM	#13
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	I had to move the needle from the middle to the 4th /richer needle clip. middle clip was too lean. already did needle testing. most of the issue now is idle (closed throttle) and WOT...the mid range is ok. This is all after I installed the 70mm big bore kit. stock config was 38p 130m mid clip 3rd position. perfect plug read.
	0

01-05-2024, 01:25 AM	#14
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Cool your Jets So I inspected the plug after my 2 economy runs without WOT. It still appears to be close to lean, as in ash gray but no real brown tinge. I have decided to up the pilot to 45 from 42 and dropped the main from 135 to 132. needle still in 4th position. A/F was between 2 and 2.5 turns out. the ebay Xring chain has stretched with break in slack so have decided to up tooth the front sprocket gain from 16 to 17 with the 44 rear. While taking off the sprocket cover the oil cooler sump adapter appears to be a leak point...I will either add thread tape or sealant as the oring does not appear to seat with the intake and outlet banjo bolts in the correct position and cant make another half or full turn to snug up... Attached Thumbnails
	1

01-06-2024, 08:01 PM	#15
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,329	Ok so rain stopped and roads dried up for a Sunday loop... 17F-44R was fine.. Manged about 50mph in 5th gear on a 45* incline. As for the carb tuning...well its seems the 132 is perhaps still to big and or the 4th clip is now out of whack with the bigger 45 pilot jet... I get fish biting about 7000rpm WOT on the flat... and if a sharply back off there is a bog sometimes... But decel popping has subsided under engine braking So I think the 45 pilot is correct. Which suffice to say suggest its either the clip now to rich and needs to go back to the middle 3rd position... Or my time waiting for the 132-134 main jets was a waste because 130 or less is required for WOT... As I have basically gone down the Main jets from 150 all the back to 130 with the same WOT lurch symptom. I will try 3rd clip with current 45/132 as I CBF servicing the carb right now. Dr Appointment in Tuesday in regards to back/sciatic issues, So no major bike overhauls till after...
	0