Where is my oil filter?!

Newt232 · 06-18-2022, 06:49 PM

I did an oil change, or started to, but then realized that I can't seem to locate the oil filter in this engine. Where the heck is it? I see the hawk has a filter cover on the right side of the motor under the cylinder and don't seem to have that. Do I need to take off the whole right side cover or can I just assume the engine doesn't have an oil filter?

Mudflap · 06-18-2022, 07:27 PM

Should be near the bottom left side of the engine, a large cap facing the side with a 17mm head. Just a screen not a filter. There is a centrifugal filter on the right side under the side cover attached to the crankshaft.

Newt232 · 06-19-2022, 08:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mudflap

Should be near the bottom left side of the engine, a large cap facing the side with a 17mm head. Just a screen not a filter. There is a centrifugal filter on the right side under the side cover attached to the crankshaft.

I took the 17mm head off and pulled the screen out. Do I need to take off the kick start and the clutch to get the right side cover off? Seems like a PITA...

XLsior · 06-19-2022, 09:06 AM

Unless the drained oil is pasty thick and the screen is full of scrags there should be little reason to service the centrifugal oil filter which typically gets look at when servicing the clutch pack.

Regular oil changes is typically enough of a flush to keep the engine operating.

Megadan · 06-19-2022, 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newt232

I took the 17mm head off and pulled the screen out. Do I need to take off the kick start and the clutch to get the right side cover off? Seems like a PITA...

The typical service interval for Honda centrifugal oil filter service is 7500 miles. So, you won't need to worry about it for a while, especially if you do regular oil changes as XLsior states.

The only recommendation I make when doing oil changes is to drain the oil from both the sump and remove the screen cap. The sump drain bolt is the one on the bottom of the engine, and even if you remove the cap a decent amount of oil and sediment will remain in the sump area. It's not a bad idea to inspect and clean the screen each time.

Newt232 · 06-19-2022, 09:26 AM

Pulled off the clutch cover and to my surprise there was no filter behind it, but there was an interesting 'mod' done to the cover itself by a previous owner. I pulled the crankshaft cover on the other side already, there was nothing under there either. Looks like this engine doesn't have a filter after all... strange! I guess I'll just fill it with oil and pray that there's no grit in there.

Newt232 · 06-19-2022, 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Megadan

The typical service interval for Honda centrifugal oil filter service is 7500 miles. So, you won't need to worry about it for a while, especially if you do regular oil changes as XLsior states.

The only recommendation I make when doing oil changes is to drain the oil from both the sump and remove the screen cap. The sump drain bolt is the one on the bottom of the engine, and even if you remove the cap a decent amount of oil and sediment will remain in the sump area. It's not a bad idea to inspect and clean the screen each time.

I did see little bits of sediment in the screen which I knocked out a little bit. I can pull it again and take a photo of what remains and flush with WD40. I've ridden this off and on four four years without a filter change but this is weekend riding not serious miles.

franque · 06-19-2022, 09:31 AM

The centrifugal filter is the round 'disc' on the right with three Phillips-appearing screws. They're actually JIS, which is just different enough that if you attempt to remove them with a standard Phillips screwdriver, you'll just strip them out. I would suggest buying a "Vessel JIS #2" off of Amazon if you get the hankering to remove it. There's also a paper gasket inside of it.

Also, the "filter" doesn't get changed, just cleaned.

Megadan · 06-19-2022, 09:48 AM

Circled in black is the centrifugal filter.

Mudflap · 06-19-2022, 11:23 AM

I don't pull the oil screen on my CG engines when I change the oil since I've never found any debris in any of them. I may clean out the centrifugal filter every couple of years or 10,000 to 20,000 miles. What I find in the centrifugal filter is maybe 1/4 teaspoon of fine powdered metal stuck together around the edge. The main thing is just change the oil every 1000 to 1500 miles.

Megadan · 06-19-2022, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mudflap

I don't pull the oil screen on my CG engines when I change the oil since I've never found any debris in any of them. I may clean out the centrifugal filter every couple of years or 10,000 to 20,000 miles. What I find in the centrifugal filter is maybe 1/4 teaspoon of fine powdered metal stuck together around the edge. The main thing is just change the oil every 1000 to 1500 miles.

Most of the time the screen mainly needs to be checked during break in. That tends to be when you will find shavings get caught in it. After that it's usually clean most of the time.

With having my oil cooler installed and my engine past break in, I rarely check the screen on the line to the cooler anymore and simply just drain it at the sump. I might check it again here soon, but the last time I did it was clear.

Megadan · 06-19-2022, 11:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Newt232

I did see little bits of sediment in the screen which I knocked out a little bit. I can pull it again and take a photo of what remains and flush with WD40. I've ridden this off and on four four years without a filter change but this is weekend riding not serious miles.

The thing to understand about the CG engine design is that it was actually intended to be run with shitty dirty oil and poor service intervals lol. Honda developed the CG125 for third world abuse and not Bob and Ted in America who obsess over oil changes every third Tuesday with high grade synthetic oil. It uses large oil passages and minimal circuits with a combined splash oiling and fairly loose tolerances. Basically, nothing to get fouled up or damaged easily.

Heck, even the oil change intervals that many of us do here every 1500ish miles are technically on the excessive side. CSC states their oil change interval after break in around 2500 miles in "normal" riding conditions for the TT250. I run Rotella T6 15w40 Synthetic with a large oil cooler. I have pushed my oil to 2k miles now and just now changed it. Aside from a little fuel saturation, it's still in decent shape, if a bit on the dark side.

Granted, if all you do is crawl around in the mud in summer temps and beat the crap out of it at high RPM and low speed, the oil will need more attention much sooner, but if you are just puttering around on easy trails or daily riding it on the street, that oil can go quite a bit longer.

Newt232 · 06-20-2022, 11:15 AM

My next question was going to be about the interval but that answers it! While I had the side cover off I got a dremel in there and ground down the frame a little bit to allow my oil plug/thermometer to thread into the cover and now I can monitor oil temps in the crankcase! I had the thing idling and saw it rise to about 30C, but another question I have is what is the 'danger zone' for that oil? I used the generic brand 15w40, not the full synthetic either. I will update with temps from the next ride I go on. Thanks everyone!

06-19-2022, 09:48 AM	#9
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 8,110	Circled in black is the centrifugal filter. __________________ Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 2024 Royal Enfield Shotgun 650 https://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=34124
	3

06-18-2022, 07:27 PM	#2
Mudflap Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 1,931	Should be near the bottom left side of the engine, a large cap facing the side with a 17mm head. Just a screen not a filter. There is a centrifugal filter on the right side under the side cover attached to the crankshaft.
	0

06-19-2022, 09:06 AM	#4
XLsior Join Date: Aug 2020 Location: Australia Posts: 1,454	Unless the drained oil is pasty thick and the screen is full of scrags there should be little reason to service the centrifugal oil filter which typically gets look at when servicing the clutch pack. Regular oil changes is typically enough of a flush to keep the engine operating.
	1

06-19-2022, 09:31 AM	#8
franque Join Date: Nov 2017 Location: Marseille, France -> Conakry, Guinea Posts: 1,481	The centrifugal filter is the round 'disc' on the right with three Phillips-appearing screws. They're actually JIS, which is just different enough that if you attempt to remove them with a standard Phillips screwdriver, you'll just strip them out. I would suggest buying a "Vessel JIS #2" off of Amazon if you get the hankering to remove it. There's also a paper gasket inside of it. Also, the "filter" doesn't get changed, just cleaned.
	4

06-19-2022, 11:23 AM	#10
Mudflap Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 1,931	I don't pull the oil screen on my CG engines when I change the oil since I've never found any debris in any of them. I may clean out the centrifugal filter every couple of years or 10,000 to 20,000 miles. What I find in the centrifugal filter is maybe 1/4 teaspoon of fine powdered metal stuck together around the edge. The main thing is just change the oil every 1000 to 1500 miles.
	1

06-20-2022, 11:15 AM	#13
Newt232 Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 25	My next question was going to be about the interval but that answers it! While I had the side cover off I got a dremel in there and ground down the frame a little bit to allow my oil plug/thermometer to thread into the cover and now I can monitor oil temps in the crankcase! I had the thing idling and saw it rise to about 30C, but another question I have is what is the 'danger zone' for that oil? I used the generic brand 15w40, not the full synthetic either. I will update with temps from the next ride I go on. Thanks everyone!
	0