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ATV Discounter Scam thread + Fraudulent title thread
So I finally get my bike today after 2 weeks. I was pretty excited that was until I open the box and find out it looks a bit different then what I ordered. The side plastics on the gas tank are a different design, the seat is different, the rear side panels are different,different front headlight design exc. There is battery acid leaking everywhere all over the parts. They sent me this lame baby blue (the picture makes it look nicer then it is) 05/06 Model instead of my navy blue 2008... I don't know if they thought I was mentally challenged and could not tell the difference or what so I call them up smokin from the ears of course they go to "connect" me to the shipping dept. and I get hung up on. I call back at least 6 times before I call a different one of their numbers and finally get to talk to someone. First she tells me I must be mistaken because it is the correct one then she finally believes me when I refuse to back down but tells me to send her pictures and then call back Monday because the manager left for the weekend.. I do some investigating and realize that apparently im not the first to have this type of problem with them and their 20 negative feedback strikes reflect it from the past 6 months. I just hope they send me out the correct bike and pick this one up without making me wait another month 8O I don't even know if they will take care of me on Monday if not I need to consider other options.
This is the link to the bike I bought and this is what I got.. You can see on the tag it was made 04/2006. You can also see some of what the battery acid did in the box in the last pic. http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...TODAY.m238.lVI http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/461/bikesidelr6.jpg http://img144.imageshack.us/img144/7089/sidedy7.jpg http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/4633/boxex3.jpg |
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thats shittty.
looks like even the chain wasnt put on right |
Is that a gy2?
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And the sticker doesn't seem to make it street legal either. Says OFF-HIGHWAY twice. Did they tell you it was?
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I think what that means is that the bike itself meets all of the DOT and EPA standards...but it's TECHNICALLY an off road bike. However, the fact that it has brake lights, turn signals, headlights, blah blah blah allow it to be street legal most places. Like for example...here in Michigan, you can take quite a few legal dirtbikes (that don't normally get driven on the street) and make them street legal by adding the requisite lights and such. I'm ASSUMING that's what that sticker is all about...but yah, I noticed that too. |
Like I mentioned in this thread : http://chinariders.net/modules.php?n...asc&highlight=
It is not always what you buy is what you get... Hopefully you can get it straightened out though |
Man. I'd be pissed! :evil: Isn't it legal to shoot someone in Texas for sending you the wrong bike?!?! :twisted:
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That totally sucks...
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Yep, they pulled a fast one.
Forget about all that trivial side panel, tank, seat and headlight stuff and the baby blue color :lol: because from what I see you ordered a bike that has a counter balanced engine and got an older non-counter balanced model that they are most likely trying to get rid of. The leaking battery acid is a big problem for you to be able to assemble it safely or to ship it back safely.Plus what has gottten damaged by the leaking acid? (of course we all know that regular old BAKING soda will neutralize that battery acid dont we) Maybe you can get them to just refund $400-600 bucks or so and call it even since they are going to be out a lot more than that by the time they get it all straight with shipping the right bike and paying for the acid spill cleanup in your garage. Of course then you'd be stuck with that baby blue bike. call the shipping company and have them check that trailer for leaking acid and let them bark at ATVdiscounters for awhile for moving unsafe cargo. Looking in the background of the pictures on their auction I wonder if ALL those quads are inventory or in for service/warranty work. :lol: |
I find this situation oddly deceitful.
If you look closely at the auction pages, it shows the pictures of the newer Lifan bikes...however, if you click the links to "see pictures" it shows pictures of EXACTLY the bike that was shipped to Porterz. Seems like bait and switch to me... |
Well I feel that porterz has the upper hand in many ways and will win this dispute very easily to his satisfaction.
How did you pay? credit card? dispute it and let the credit card company chew on them a bit. I wonder if EBAY would step in and help (I doubt it) but I thought they had some vehicle purchase protection crap. http://pages.motors.ebay.com/buy/pur...ion/index.html |
I will see what they say monday. I just want the bike I ordered.. I do not want this one even if I get money back. I am worried that if they do take it back they will just say to ship the old one back first and wait for the other one to come in stock and they will then have my money (credit card) and a tracking number where they "sent" me the bike to give to the credit card company so I cannot make a claim. I would only feel comfortable if when they droped off the correct bike they picked up this one at the same time. Oh yea.. and I would not let the driver leave untill I check the box lol I would be fine with that but it would be nice if they did something to make up for the waiting and the trouble like extra parts or something but judging by their feedback they "Have no business ethics" lol
I was pretty upset when I first opened the box I almost kicked the bike but I held myself back :) - Eric PS: I found out it originated from "American Lifan Industry, Inc 10990 Petal St, Suite 500 Dallas, TX75238. That's what the stickers said on the parts bags and owners manual. |
That sucks!!
I'm hear in texas if you need a help hanging someone. :D |
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The EPA plate says the bike was certified to the off-road emission standard (which just so happens to be less demanding than the on-road emission standard). It is in violation of US federal regulations for a licensed motor vehicle dealer to sell that bike for use on the street - or in fact for the manufacturer to even equip it with only-needed-on-the-street features like turn signals and a license holder. That, my friend, is a black market bike.
But could you license it and ride it on the street? In most places in the USA you sure can, because the local county tax offices aren't paid or trained to enforce federal regulations. HTH, tcs |
BTW, I seem to remember that on the "Lifan Dealerships in Texas, DFW area" thread you mentioned how much less expensive your 'net ordered bike was going to be than one another poster had purchased at an authorized, brick&mortar American Lifan dealer.
tcs |
Not a good way to start out..Good luck geting it resolved man.
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I can just about promise you what they will tell you in the end. They will tell you to ship the bike back to them (at your expense, $300 +/-) and they will ship you the correct bike (also at your expense). Then, "Oops, looks like the bike you want is temperarily out of stock. But, if you don't mind waiting for the next shipment to come in from mainland China (6 - 10 weeks), they will ship you the correct bike when it arrives. OR, you can just keep that one". You, my friend, just got the shaft (dry, I might add)! If you used PayPal, file a grievance and get your money back. Then the ball is in their court to prove you DID NOT get screwed.
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PS: It's also strange instead of a 14F and 46R sprocket it has a 14F and 56R. That seems like a really big difference. That means its geared lower for less top end speed? Maybe because it's an older model.. I know it sounds stupid but im really picky and I don't like the older styling of the bike or the color and I don't like the idea of the older motor especially with all the vibration issues I hear of. Can they get away with this!?? I did not use paypal. In fact they actually filed a non payment strike against me on ebay because they made a mistake because I called and used my cc instead because my paypal was not working that day. I now regret not using it. Perhaps thats why they did it because they thought they could get away with it since I dident use paypal? Maybe im overreacting and it was just a mistake and they will fix it but I hate waiting to find out my destiny. |
Porter,
If you DID pay by credit card or PayPal, if they aren't willing to do anything for you at all, you should definitely file a claim with the credit card or PayPal. Hell, I might do it even if they say they'll fix the problem just to be on the safe side. If you paid by PayPal and they say they are taking care of it, filing the dispute with PayPal may help th "hurry" the situation along... |
Looks like monday will only be the start of it for porterz.
The worst thing is he got an overpriced, outdated, non-counter balanced bike(with acid damage). I myself will most likely never do another mail order bike and I'm seriously thinking of just selling our bikes and getting my wife a tw200 and me a drz400s. Looks like I'll be riding my bike before porterz, now mind you it is still in the 40's here for high temps and snow on the ground and I wont ride on the streets untill a good thunderstorm washes all that nasty salt off the roads so it could be a month or so for me. This michigan winter stinks but april 1st means new ORV tags and we can take the quads up north and ride. |
Add an "M" to the end of that DRZ-400S...
Drooooooolllll....DRZ-400SM....DROOOOOOLLLL!!!!!! |
looks like they are trying to screw you bro..
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I had this same thing happen to me with another dealer on an ATV.They told me that the owner was out of town in meetings and when he got back he could make the decission on what to do.You can read the full account in dealer review forum.
It took a month for them to make it rite.If I were you I would start the ball rolling on filing a claim with the credit card company.Be prepared to hear every excuse known to man and everything they offer you will be to the benifit of them not you. At least by filing a dispute they know your seriouse and that may give you some leverage. I went to their web site and I couln't find anything about Lifan? http://www.atvdiscounter.com/ |
Wheres the link to the actual page you bought your bike from?
edit, found it on page 1 anyways, Looking here, http://www.atvdiscounter.com/Dirt-Bi...oductInfo.aspx You will see pictures of the balanced engine, but it does not say it has it, in fact it says # Engine Type:Single-cylinder,air-cooled,four-stroke # Engine model: 163FML-2 Which is the non-balanced version... Of course, I don't know what the ad you got it from actually said, and either way they are trying to screw you... edit 2: looking at the ad more closely (your ebay ad) It also states the same details about the engine # Engine Type:Single-cylinder,air-cooled,four-stroke # Engine model: 163FML-2 Which is non balanced, however they are using pictures of the balanced engine... Also they said you were getting a gy5 and you got a gy2, smaller gas tank lower seat height I'm not sure what else I highly doubt they are an "authorized american lifan dealer" like you said you saw somewhere though... I don't know where they told you that, but I bet if you check with american lifan you will soon find out it was a lie, I think they might be interested to find out that they were claiming to be... Unless you just got that impression from the swing arm decal or something, I believe all the US lifans will say american lifan on them if they came from Chingqing, I believe it has to do with how C.L. exports them... |
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However the ad was actually for a GY-5, but maybe not the balanced one... "# Year: 2008 # Make: Lifan # Model: LF200GY-5" About the sprockets, I believe the 2's usually had the different sprockets from the 5's, but I also think it is up to the importer to specify... I think your best arguments are the damage (battery), and the wrong model, you should have got a # Motorcycle model: LF200GY-5 , but you got a LF200GY-2. The engine is listed as unbalanced, but pictured as balanced... If they told you in an email or something that it was balanced you may have a stronger argument there. |
For a while EBAY was even tight on the color of the item being correct and that the stated color in the auction is what they had to send you or something to that effect but anyway.
That auction is very misleading if they have all those pictures of the one bike and then a cheesy tiny link to pictures of what they will be sending. I really dont see much of a leg for "ATVdeceivers" to stand on. :lol: I say hit them fast, hard and often until you win. |
Take this for what it's worth, Porterz...
...but I sent an e-mail yesterday to the guy at MotoXtreme (because I'm still not 100% sure if I want the Hi-Bird or the Lifan) and asked him if he was selling only American Lifan bikes. He told me that ALL of the bikes that are actually American Lifan bikes come with the sprockets setup for highway driving. He said taht I may be getting confused and that some of the Lifan bikes from China will have the 56t rear sprockets. I also found out by researching that American Lifan is pretty strict with who can and can't ship their products. MotoXtreme is one of the FEW dealers I've found that is actually allowed to drop ship American Lifan bikes. I think that you got screwed, bro. I think you got a bike that is a Lifan, but not an American Lifan. I don't think that makes a very big deal, but it's a crappy thing to not get what you're paying for. And trust me...since you used your credit card instead of PayPal you are in good hands. Call your credit card company and tell them you got shafted. They WILL get you your money back. Also, in a really crappy way, thanks for posting about this. I was thinking about purchasing the Lifan from ATVDiscounters because they were cheaper than MotoXtreme...but after reading this, I will now be getting my Lifan from MotoX or the Hi-Bird from VBikes. |
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I agree with filing a complaint tith your credit card company. Phone them up and tell them exactly what's going on. You didn't get the bike you ordered at all, wrong year and wrong model. Usually the card companies are really good about stopping payments on something like this (drop the FRAUD word, for that's what it is!). Stop payment on the card, tell ATVDiscounters that they need to arrange a pickup if they want the bike back and that you WILL NOT pay any form of shipping. What they did really is illegal, let them know that you know it is. Don't back down at all, you should be able to contact your local district attorney's office for more info on what recourse is available to you (make sure that ATVDiscounters know that you're contacting the DA, if the bike was shipped across state lines you might want to look into any federal laws that have been broken as well. You can undo what's been done, but you can make ATVDiscounter's regret trying to screw you! |
As I have said before , I bought from these guys. But I walked in and said "Ill take that one". I did a lot of talking with "AMERICAN LIFAN" before my purchase. They told me that these bikes did come from them. Kinda blows the Network, Authorized dealer thing out of the water. But I can tell you for sure that there is no 2008 bikes in thier inventory. 06 07 only. And as far as thier warranty .... take it with you in the morning when you go to the restroom. I had the parts guy backed into a corner trying to get a lens cover. If you need someone local to help deal with the corporate office let me know. BTW that number is 817-717-7018 and 817 717 7012 in fact 7001-7019 will get you different people with the company.
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Wait.. If they don't have any 08 bikes how did they take the picture of it in front of their store? |
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I really don't think this sale of the bike or getting screwed by the dealer really has any relation to A.L.. Apparently A.L. is owned by Chongqing Lifan, and really I believe this is the only reason the bike says anything about it, import export rules or something... But this all has to do with ATV Discounters and NOT A.L.. Like mr Hyak has said, I don't think there really is a specific model year, you look mainly at the manufacturing date, the differences all come as per importers specs... Technically the ebay ad says you get the NON balanced motor, however it has it pictured, you should check out what ebay's policies are on this. The ad also says you get a GY5, this is where they really screwed you, they sent you a GY2 instead. The leaky acid is an accident, the wrong model is them screwing you... Either way I'm not sure you will end up with a balanced engine, but definetly check what ebay's policies are for posting images of the WRONG product... The pictures are of the right model bike, wrong model engine, they sent you the wrong model bike, with the right model engine. |
Call A.L. They will tell you that ATV Discounters got the bikes from them. Best I can tell the bike pictured I can tell its an 08. I didnt say they never had them. I said they dont have them now. I called every store and thier internet department... none!
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I did a better bussiness beuro search. They have 31 claims filed against them.
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That bites that you did not get what you expected. I told you that I looked at that place before I bought a HiBird. All they had then was 1 gy2 at the Ft worth store. I looked at the Watauga store and they did not have any 200's. The Stemmons Frwy store did have a GY5 But the salesman insisted that it was a dirt bike and illegal on the street.
I hope it is resolved to your satisfaction but have a feeling it wont be. |
You could ask them to ship you a set of body panels with a better color and the correct sprocket and a new parts box and contents. Hang the neg feedback over them and do the hold on the CC if necessary.
At least that way you'll have something to ride without waiting another month and shipping hassles. :cry: I thought A.L. doesn't allow internet sales anyway??? |
The bike most likely was old-stock that AL dumped to that importer
company when they switched to GY-5 (just a hunch). It looks to be exactly like the GY-2 that Hoopers sells. http://www.hooperimports.com/zoom_im...1147057362.jpg |
File a claim with you Credit Card company. They will act faster if they don't have the money.
Do it now. You only have 60 days from the sale date. Tell them to come and get that bike and buy one from someone reputable. If they don't come and get it sell me the rear caliper and the sidepanels. :lol: Allen |
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