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Dot approved for sure... Snell approval I am not sure, I think it is a good idea, but others argue that there are stats that accidents with snell approved helmets cause more damage.... I'm still out on this one so I will not advise... My helmet is snell approved for what it's worth. |
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We're seeing the same people :P |
I find gear serves 2 purposes, the second of which people new to the motorcycle game (i.e me) are not aware:
1) Safety. A helmet and jacket can be the difference between feeling stupid and a concussion with a skin graft chaser. 2) Comfort. I started riding with a denim jacket, MX gloves, and a DOT MX helmet. The following year I invested in a waterproof/armoured mesh jacket and leather/mesh gauntlets. Huge difference in ride comfort. Huge. This week I hope to be adding a pair of ATV boots to the mix and maybe a new DS lid. http://www.afxhelmets.com/img/product/37ds/09-flat.jpg My motivation for the additional gear was safety but the difference in comfort on the pavement was night and day, particularly in the Spring and Fall. |
So you are a vintage club member too? Which club do you ride with mr. fly? Unless you have proper gear you don't ride with me or the people I ride with. I ride with riding instructors. The same guys that will be testing you on you M licence. Unless you have proper gear you don't get to take your M2 test let alone ride your M test. These guys will have nothing to do with you because you already know it all. The instructors wear nice gear. They've been at it longer than you or I. They have upgraded over time. They didn't go out and spend thousands on gear to be cool, they spent hundreds to be safer.
When I ride on Sundays, there is often 1000 years of experience in our group. Their gear ain't about image Mr. Fly. John is 82 years old and has good gear, and absolutely no Image to speak of. On the 401 I see idiots all the time in beany helmets and t-shirts. Good luck to you and the people you ride with. What is obvious is that you do a lot of riding with people I don't talk to. But the several hundred people I've ridden with all wear gear, ( ATTGAT.) or they are shunned till they do. I won't ride with someone not concerned about safety. They are a danger to me and the people I ride with. |
Ok, people step away from the keyboard. :)
Fly is entitled to his opinion, eventhough it may not be shared by others. Let's leave it at that. Having been to Toronto on several occasions, I think I'd ride in full kevlar. Don Valley Parkway, yikes! |
Sorry, yep you're right. Gear is just a statement for the image people. I'll never wipe out, I don't need gear. Gear is over rated. I never be suckered into paying for gear again.
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I have my M, which I took wearing my usual gear of helmet, work boots, jeans, and sweatshirt.
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knothead, Thanks for the info.
Those boots are on my "short list". They look to be a nice upgrade from my Icon boots. :) |
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I have my M, which I took wearing a sweatshirt.
That is a bold-faced lie! :evil: |
http://www.webbikeworld.com/Motorcycle-Safety/crash.htm
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This girl was wearing a sweatshirt...
WARNING, GRAPHIC PICTURES AHEAD, MAY NOT BE WORK SAFE The pictures: http://www.motortopia.com/album/view...760/i/roadrash The story: http://www.motortopia.com/blogs/view...h_cause_effect The pictures are a year later (not all of them, but you'll figure out which ones) Here's a chart on abbrasion resistance.... I don't see sweatshirt listed, but kevlar, various forms of leather, and denim... http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h3...stuck/gear.jpg And one on helmet impact areas... http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h3...uck/helmet.jpg Findings from the Hurt report: http://www.magpie.com/nycmoto/hurt.html Quote:
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As well as good gear a proper rider training course is always a good idea.
I bought the red (or orange) Lifan as opposed to the black one. In stead of removing mandatory reflectors (I don't know why people do this), I have added additional DOT reflector tape (NOTE: RED IS FOR THE BACK ONLY) to increase the conspicuity (see the bright spots below, ). Granted this doesn't add to front or rear conspicuity, but I always ride with the lights on. http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h3.../reflector.jpg http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h3...reflector2.jpg |
Both of those charts were given out at my riding course.
Have you ever seen a rider with a telephone pole up the butt and through the belly? Want to see it? ride2die.com He lived, but pissed into a bag for the rest of his life. Real cool pics for the kiddies. ride2die.com check it out. Started by people who lost loved ones to riding. Lots of pics of bikes that have cut through cars killng both drivers. Real cool vids too. The day after I checked out ride2die, I took my course. I wanted to see what I was getting into. My first name on this site was new2riding. I took it from ride2die, no mystery. Gear will not make you safe, but it lowers the chance of death in a wipeout. Absolutely proven to reduce physio, the numbers of skin grafts, and pain medication costs. A full face helmet ain't cool on my 1972 honda. Gear ain't about being cool, it's about being honest and intelligent. Why is it most riders treat their bikes like gold, but some treat their body like scrap metal? http://home1.gte.net/res0ak9f/bike.htm Motorcycle rider fatalities in the past five years increased by 47 percent. Loud Pipes Save Lives Are you kidding? Do we need to cover this again? - The vast majority of bike accidents are from the front. To have any chance of alerting those motorists to the presence of a motorcycle with exhaust noise would require that the tailpipe be pointed forward. LOL. The chances of rearward-facing straight pipes making a bike more obvious are very slim. The reality of the loud pipe is that all you'll succeed in doing is irritating all the people behind and beside you who don't pose much of a threat anyway. - You are pissing off everyone around you. So who cares if you gun the throttle past an open driver's-side window and scare the hell out of the occupants? At least they see you, right? Maybe, but take a look at what happened to personal watercraft in Minnesota. Take a look at what happened in Yellowstone. Put it another way: how much do you appreciate the "music" blaring from other people's cars: the throbbing car stereo that shakes the very ground with some indistinguishable bass crap? How interested in someone else's music are you? Perhaps nobody else wants to listen to it. Perhaps they don't like the sound. Maybe they're trying to concentrate, or talk, or watch TV, or sleep. Maybe their kids are trying to sleep. - Loud exhaust pipes are illegal. Even HD has finally stopped installing them. and .... loud exhaust pipes actually REDUCE the performance of the bike in most cases, due to the reduction of back-pressure needed by tuned engines. For riders: Always wear a helmet Always wear protective gear Never ride under the influence Ride only in good weather conditions Ride responsibly Assume you’re invisible, constantly scan the road Ride extra defensively Take regular MSF courses Please check out ride2die http://home1.gte.net/res0ak9f/bike.htm |
And if you don't have it, you can grab the "You and Your Motorcycle" Riding Tips MSF booklet from the American Lifan website.
http://www.americanlifan.com/lifan3/customer.html |
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I assume you're insinuating that there is some type of gear requirement in Ontario, and I could not have had my test in a sweatshirt? There is. I always wear my helmet. It is the only requirement. Read the motorcycle handbook. |
Let's try to put the arguments behind us, and carry on with the topic at hand.... Gear and Safety.
*Said in general to anyone, not directed at anyone in specific* It is up to you to decide what you ride in. However it is a good idea to take a look at the statistics, what can happen, and so on. I don't think it is ever a good idea to recommend that a new rider go with out gear though. |
I've never heard anyone say after a spill, "I wore way too much gear". In contrast I've read numerous accounts of people stating that helmets and jackets have saved their lives/hide.
To be honest, I don't feel comfortable on the street without my Jacket/gloves anymore. The more gear I wear the more relaxed I feel. |
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Since I bought a neck brace, I can't go on the track without it. I feel naked without it. That, and my helmet. I won't even ride down the driveway without a helmet. |
I'm not going to brow beat you about this (well, maybe some!), but you'll find out that riding on the street is a whole different animal than riding mx. The dirt is way more forgiving when you go down and you don't have brain dead houswives or pissed off-late for a meeting salesmen in 6000lb SUVs trying to kill you on the track.
You can't predict when or where it will happen, but you can bet that it WILL sooner or later. I've seen too many of my buddies laid up in the hospital w/multiple surgeries(skin gets ground away, then muscle, bone too)... the right gear would have let them walk away unhurt. It's your choice, but you really need to take what we're telling you to heart. Quote:
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Sound familiar? :) And while you and I may not want a Volvo or care about airbags, there are many people who do want and care about those things. Consider a man with a family of small children. He wants to be sure he gets home every night. He wants to be sure his Volvo can take the hit if his wife is taking his kids to school in the morning. I'm sure you're aware of the saying "one man's trash is another man's treasure". Safety gear is not much different, and it's rather narrowminded, IMO, to make assumptions about the reasons other people choose to wear gear. I'm sure that some people do buy the gear as accessory. I will not, however, make the assumptions as to which people they might be. I think everyone deserves the benifit of the doubt unless/until they prove otherwise. Give your fellow riders a bit more credit in the future, please. 8) |
Just a couple of thoughts on the subject at hand...
Attitude as Gear I've dropped my horse before, and I'm probably going to drop it again someday. Usually when I get to cocky in my abilities and/or my gear. I think the safest thing a rider can take with him is the correct attitude while riding. Aggression, Malice, and Over-Confidence are not safe attitudes to ride in. With that stated, I find I ride better Properly kitted out. Look sharp, feel sharp, BE sharp, right? John Law/The Man I've noticed, I get stopped a whole heck of a lot less when I am all kitted out, than when I am free-airing it. More specifically, I notice my half-helmet is a cop magnet. I attract a whole heck of a lot less "Law Enforcement Attention" when I am wearing my modular helmet. That being said, all my gear is black or blue. I don't know what kind of attention more colourful gear attracts from the local constabulary. Anyone care to post regarding? Insurance I think we can safely assume, given the facts Posted previously, by Sir Jim, Commander KnotHead, et all, that proper gear leads to less traumatic injuries in the event of a fall. What angers me, is when some dweebus in flip flops and a wife-beater drops his horse, and burgerizes his carcas, My insurance rates go up! I mean really, I try to be as socialist as I can be, but shouldn't there be some sort of insurance discount for those of us with reasonably decent gear? Experience as it relates to gear My first jacket was a piece of crap. Terribly fitted, floppy, nasty cold crap. Loose floppy collar that beat the schidt out of my face at highway speed, cuffs that slid halfways up my arms in the wind, and a body fit that made me look like the hunchback of NotreDame with it balooning out behind me. I went through 3 more jackets before I got my custom-built Langlitz, that fits like a motorcycle jacket should. If I would have known then what I do know now, I could have saved a whole crap load of money of schidtty jackets, that now rot away quietly in my closet. This is part of the reason I am very hesitant to buy pant/chaps for riding. If it doesn't fit, doesn't feel good, or makes me look like a retarded gorilla, with a big ass, it's going to sit there in the closet, rotting away, with the crappy fitting leathers. The saddest part of it is, all the jackets felt just lovely in the store. Looked decent, etc. It wasn't until I got out on the highway that I realized just how bad a bad jacket can be. Getting bannock-slapped by your own jacket at highway speed is not safe, no matter whether it had CE armour of not... What might help the newbs... As I mentioned, there's a whole pile of crap sitting in my closet, a Shoei helmet that feels like crap on my head, a couple of armoured gloves that feel like my old boxing gloves on the throttle, and a shiny new pair of Vega Boots that didn't fit me whatsoforikilatingever. (steel toed Docs all the way 4ever!) What a great use of closet space. They're worth Nothing. Somewhere, somehow, I'd like to see a cosmic gift exchange set up to donate unused kit to new riders, so hopefully they don't have to ride in a 15 year old Belstaff, and a Denim jacket, like I did when I was starting out. Although it could be very difficult to set up the logistics to prevent the exchange from abuse and freeloaders. Personalities vs. Visibility A GOB (Good Ole Boy) friend of mine always rode in a Day-Glo orange helmet, Blaze orange jacket, and purple armoured pants. He looked like a total twinkus, especially considering we was at least 70 years old when I met him. He explained it to me this way, "Ain't no one ever said, I didn't see you!" Well, he had a point, but at 6'7" it's my life's work not to get noticed. Studies have shown that brightly coloured gear does make you more noticed on the road. Bright gear doesn't automatically mean poser. Personally, I can't stand it though. (One of the jackets in the closet is a Joe Rocket.) Comfortable gear doesn't necessarily mean fit. To sum Up The same GOB who wore the Shoei sprayed orange once said something rather profound, Specifically,"Can you afford having no hands?" when I complained that I couldn't afford decent gloves. Especially being an auto mechanic, no hands=no job. I think we could expand that to, "If you can't afford the gear, you can't afford the ride" That being said, it's a building process, finding what works for you, and what risk you are willing to take. I really would like to hear about Bright gear and the law though, if anyone has any experience with it? --Vince |
These "Draggin Jeans" look interesting, odd way to test safety mind you
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BNVs...eature=related I found similair ones called undercover jeans which are cheaper, but I think the same thing... Kevlar lined jeans. |
Anyone use mesh jackets? Opinions?
I was looking at these ones, mesh http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=290298542053 leather / mesh http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=290298059128 leather http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=290298763797 I haven't owned a jacket with armor in it before, just typical leather jackets.... I bet the ce armor would be an added bonus in the event the jacket was needed... I've bought a few things from those guys in the past and they seemed ok to deal with... |
I use a mesh Shift brand jacket in the summer. I consider it required for survival in the summer heat here...along w/ my mesh pants.
I like the mesh material. It's almost like not even wearing a jacket, since the air flows right through. The biggest thing about the armor is making sure they cover the areas expected. Many people complain about knee armor, for example, not sitting directly on top of their knees...and maybe moving out of position during a tumble. As long as the jacket/pants fit well, it should certainly offer more protection (and comfort) than jeans or a heavy jacket. One nice feature to look for is adjustable armor positioning. The mesh/leather jacket you linked looks nice. Before shipping it's less than I paid for my Shift mesh, and we know leather holds up to abrasion better than any other material (that I've seen) tested. That should offer a nice balance between air-flow and protection. The leather one reminds me of my Shift "Streetfighter" jacket, which is a leather/textile mix. http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com...et---2008.aspx The mesh jacket you linked might be fine as well. It's hard to know without looking at the seems and such to get an idea of how well it's made and how long it might hold up. If it will last a few years, it's a great price. If it's falling apart after 2 months... One thing I try to do is locate any potential item locally. I can try it on, look it over, ect....then I try to find the same size/brand/model online cheaper. Part of the reason I often go with the Shift brand is that I've been told (not sure it's true) it's a 'value' brand from Alpinestars, so it's basically the same company making both brands. And since Aplinestars has one of the best reputations for gear, I think it strikes a good balance between value and protection. Hope that helps. :) |
Thanks for the info :)
Yeah so far I've only got leather riding jackets, but none of them have any sort of armor, and when it gets hot out, I don't like wearing them... I think that EXL brand is likely only available on ebay, but it does say 2 year warranty... I guess maybe I'll test it out, see how it looks in real... Unless of course someone finds a screaming deal on a better jacket :lol: :lol: I was looking at newenough but didn't spot any real deals. Actually, this looks like a decent deal too, http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com...ne-Jacket.aspx |
If someone is looking for one like I posted, someone has a used one available, not my size though, 2xl, like new... I asked him what he thought of the jacket, and told him straight up it was the wrong size and I wouldn't be buying it, so there was no salesmanship in the answer...
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It isn't the same as any I posted though, but it is the same brand... Maybe it's this one http://motodirect.com/product/17_53-...501-Black.html |
I thought I'd post a link to another site where you might find a good deal on a jacket -
http://www.leatherup.com/c/Mens-Moto...ets/2/102.html I noticed one of the brands (Xelement) was really similar the brand in the ebay links, EXL. I couldn't help but wonder if they are the same company or related. I did a search and found....nada. No official site for EXL or Xelement. 8O I did find an "under construction" page for Xelement, but I find it odd that neither company would have a site. If you do make a purchase please consider posting a review and pictures...lots and lots of pictures. :) Just for the record, I found nothing to support the idea that Shift and Aplinestars are related or partnered in any way. The only link I found between the two is a lady who designed clothing for Aplinestars and now works for Shift. :lol: |
Thanks for the links :) I'm still deciding which way I'm going to go, but I've got a while yet, as the snow just left, but I have a feeling it may be back before the end of March... So I don't need a "summer" jacket quite yet... But I like to hear everyone's opinions....
I like the idea of the jackets with the CE armor built in, I have a couple leather jackets, but no armor or any sort of padding.... Takes care of the road rash part but not the impact... The EXL mesh jacket has ce armor on the back, shoulders, and elbow, where the shift only has it on the shoulders and elbows... Though I am thinking the Shift jacket is still probably better, I may go with the EXL to check it out... If I didn't go for off brands I wouldn't be riding a Lifan :lol: :lol: I actually think I may get both of these jackets, http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=290298542053 http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...m=290298059128 After that I'm going to try and decide on some pants, I haven't seen mesh pants with ce armor, though I've seen denim ones 8O I may look for textile pants with armor... I have some decent leather gloves with extra padding on the knuckles, not great gloves mind you, but they should work. |
I use a mesh jacket. Mine is the one on the bottom.
http://www.importationsthibault.com/...nglais/145.jpg I love it. Waterproof (proven!), nice ventilation, and the armor and pockets are a plus. I went down on a trail last fall, might have messed up my shoulder/elbow if not for the armor. |
Hey Jim, stay away from the EXL stuff!
A year or so ago I bought a waterproof jacket and a set of saddlebags from their website... The bags fell apart after using them 3 times,wearing the jacket is just like wearing a garbage bag, seriously! It fits poorly, the cuffs have velcro adjustments, but the material is too thick and bunches up. The outside of the jacket isn't water proof, instead it has a zip out liner that is made of nylon coated with some rubbery stuff that does not breath at all, it gets damp and clammy really quick. Did I mention that the sleeves fill with water when it rains? And the "armor" is nothing more than a really soft foam. When it comes to jackets, you can catch brand names on sale, usually for about $20 more than the no name jackets. I bought a new Tourmaster Pivot 2 for $89, there is no comparison. The Tourmaster fits really well, is actually waterproof, fits well and is holding up great. The armor in the Pivot 2 is also hardshell in the shoulders and elbows with a stiff foam in the back. Quote:
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Thanks for the feedback...
I have had better luck with them in the past, I've got a helmet, bags, and rain gear from them... The helmet is a half helmet, so really how good can it be, but it does seem just as good as my other half helmets, only it fit better... The bags (tail, and saddle bags), seemed pretty good for me, except I overloaded the tail bag with tools and the sharp end of the needle nose pliers poked a hole in it... The rain gear was better then your experience, my only complaint with it was the velcro on the neck line scratched my neck... I've got a while yet before I'll be picking up any more gear so I will keep an eye out and consider all options :) Thanks again for your experiences with EXL though. I do like the looks of the shift jackets too. |
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================== About EXL gear, it appears Jafrum may be made by the same people... http://www.jafrum.com/Motorcycle-Gea...ts/MJ2299Grey# http://motodirect.com/product/17_18-...-BlackRed.html |
Excellent article. Yay DOT!!
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I guess it's time I comment on my EXL Mesh Jacket eh?
Sorry no pictures right now.... For the price I paid I'm really happy with it... The collar is soft inside so the velcro doesn't scratch. The zippers do the job, 2 zippered pockets with liners I assume to keep the rain out if you have a phone in there for example. Lots of adjustable straps to make it fit good. Dealing with the company that sells it (which I have done in the past) is always pretty easy, they seem to be really good, and even offer a 105% refund. The jacket also has what it says is CE armor, which was commented on before as just being some foam pads, which is true, and I don't know how CE certification works, but I assume these pads would help at least a little in protecting from blunt impacts to the elbows or spine. I initially ordered a Large, however with the large, the pads would not be in the proper spots for me, so I got a medium, and it fits pretty well, with lots of adjustments, and the pads stay in the correct spots. The wrists have a velcro strap to tighten which does cork good in my opinion, the material there, with seams and whatnot for the zippers is a little thick, but over gloves it works good to tighten it up. (they have sippers running up the sleeve a few inches, the velcro strap runs partially around the circumference of the wrist). The best part, the wind blows right through it. I don't know how well it will hold up in a crash, but on hot days it keeps me from riding in a t-shirt so I think it is doing a pretty good job already. |
These are images of old British posters
http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h3...End__Large.jpg http://i60.photobucket.com/albums/h3..._it__Large.jpg And this image is property of forum moderator SpudRider http://i442.photobucket.com/albums/q...9-17-09370.jpg |
So what's everyone here wear for footwear while riding?
I'm considering getting a pair of these, http://www.leatherup.com/p/Mens-Moto...ots/53863.html They are more like a shoe then a boot, however they do go up a bit to offer some protection to the ankle... I figure they would do a better job then regular sneakers. I also just ordered a pair of these pants, http://motodirect.com/product/114_11...ker-Pants.html I've already got a pair of them, but they are size large and they're too big for me so I ordered a medium. They seem like really good, well made pants. Originally the large size was too long for me, the knee pads were more like shin pads, but I pulled them out of the pockets half way and made it work... However I've lost a bit of weight and now the waist is too big as well so I am hoping in the size medium that the inseam length is better too. It's probably not the best gear to be wearing, but I prefer the textile gear over the leather and the pants let the wind through for summer riding. I would say the pants are higher quality then my EXL jacket. The boots/shoes are probably not the best but better then sneakers, and I don't like big clunky boots. |
I wear saftey toe boots at work. They double as my riding boots. I have quite a few pairs floating around.
Never had any motorcycle specific footwear, except moto boots. |
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