Why no Honda Trail 110 clones?

jjn · 01-13-2015, 07:14 PM

As I was riding my 2009 Kymco People 150 home from Hilo on the highway, I came upon a small motorcycle riding on the shoulder. Turned out to be a bike I've seen around a few times. It's the later version of my first motorcycle I got back when I was 8 years old. A Honda Trail 90. This one I saw was, I believe, a CT-110, as I could tell it was a later model.

Now, I happen to know that a mid 60's Trail 90 is capable of hitting about 57 mph (statute of limitations long expired now!) if it's in street gear. On this island, one of these makes a lot of sense. We have LOTS of gravel and dirt and embedded rocky roads. No freeways. Main highways are posted 50-55, and they have very wide shoulders for moped riders, pedestrians, bicyclists. 50+ years ago, I never bothered checking gas mileage, but I bet a good running Trail 90 would get what, 90 mpg? And, they have a pretty good following too.

So, why no Chinese clones of the Trail 90/Trail 110? I know about the SYM Symba and the BMS 110cc Metro. And the CT-70 clones (which I do like). Someone like Skyteam could make them using their current 125cc engine that they used in the TRex, CT clone, and the monkey bike models. Some decent suspension travel, a solo seat with sturdy rack, maybe an attached spare gas container (like the CT-110's had I believe). A real front fork, rather than the Earles type, or leading link type front forks. Kick and electric start. Center stand.

I bet they'd sell!

Weldangrind · 01-14-2015, 11:30 PM

Excellent question. It would make a good clone.

katoranger · 01-15-2015, 08:30 AM

I would like to see a CT110 clone too.

SpudRider · 01-15-2015, 08:34 AM

X3; perhaps Zongshen will make one.

katoranger · 01-15-2015, 08:37 AM

It would get me back on forth to work. I can just ride the gravel and stay off the highway.

SpudRider · 01-15-2015, 08:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by katoranger

It would get me back on forth to work. I can just ride the gravel and stay off the highway.

I would love to have a Zongshen Rapido for that purpose.

http://en.zongshenmotor.com/?q=node/895

Mudflap · 01-15-2015, 09:06 AM

The only way you're going to hit 57 mph on a trail 90 is in a free fall off a cliff. That may be exaggerating a bit but I've owned several and 45 mph is about all they've got on level ground. Start up a hill or get into a headwind and you're looking at 35 mph. Still, a very light sturdy little bike that can be hauled on a bumper rack and used on and off road is very useful.

My solution is to buy a cheap and junky Trail 90 and put a Lifan engine on it. This one has the 140 cc Lifan and will cruise easily at 55. It'll also climb anything it can get traction on.

SpudRider · 01-15-2015, 09:09 AM

I doubt the Zongshen Rapido will grace our shores; but I also said that about the Zongshen RX3.

How about a Honda Grom?

http://powersports.honda.com/2014/grom.aspx

SpudRider · 01-15-2015, 09:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mudflap

The only way you're going to hit 57 mph on a trail 90 is in a free fall off a cliff. That may be exaggerating a bit but I've owned several and 45 mph is about all they've got on level ground. Start up a hill or get into a headwind and you're looking at 35 mph. Still, a very light sturdy little bike that can be hauled on a bumper rack and used on and off road is very useful.

My solution is to buy a cheap and junky Trail 90 and put a Lifan engine on it. This one has the 140 cc Lifan and will cruise easily at 55. It'll also climb anything it can get traction on.

That is nice work.

If you have time, please do post a thread on that project.

Weldangrind · 01-15-2015, 11:35 AM

A Rapido would be cool, but there is something appealing about the vintage Trail 90 vibe.

Adjuster · 01-15-2015, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mudflap

The only way you're going to hit 57 mph on a trail 90 is in a free fall off a cliff. That may be exaggerating a bit but I've owned several and 45 mph is about all they've got on level ground. Start up a hill or get into a headwind and you're looking at 35 mph. Still, a very light sturdy little bike that can be hauled on a bumper rack and used on and off road is very useful.

My solution is to buy a cheap and junky Trail 90 and put a Lifan engine on it. This one has the 140 cc Lifan and will cruise easily at 55. It'll also climb anything it can get traction on.

Very similar to my in progress project Honda Cub Chinese clone.

edit reduced pic size

/

jjn · 01-15-2015, 03:42 PM

First off, with a 12 year old laying flat on a Trail 90, and going down a hill on 348th in Federal Way, Washington, my trail 90 speedo read 57 mph. Now, 50 years ago, we didn't gps or mini cams. That was at the bottom of the third hill heading west on that street. At 12, I was a whole lot lighter than the 200 pounds I am now.

Also, an old friend of mine, right about that time, road (illegally, as he was also about 12) his yellow trail 90 from his place in Federal Way, to Yakima, Washington. I didn't go with him, but, that little bike made it there and back.

And, adjuster, how many miles have you put on that bike in the photo so far? Has it been reliable for you?

Adjuster · 01-15-2015, 04:23 PM

I have maybe 20 miles on it lol. I am a tinkerer modder so I have been messing with it more than riding it. Any reliability issues I caused myself. For instance I already stripped out the aluminum spark plug hole. Top speed with my weight is 35mph. I need to go around 40 45 in my area. For the speed reason and because I stripped out the spark plug I just purchased a new motor instead of fixing the original. A new 49cc head was going to cost me $65.00, my brand new 125cc motor cost me $205.00 plus $50.00 shipping. So far it has been an easy swap. I still have to loosen the rear wheel to get the chain back on and then I have to install my new carburetor that I purchased for the new motor. I may have some trouble with the carburetor because I want to change it from a reward mount to a forward mount carb. I may not have enough clearance under the fuel tank. I will not say these Chinese bikes are 100% reliable. However with that said anything that breaks is easy to diagnose and cheap and easy to repair. A brand new 125CC motor for $255.00 is just crazy. By the way the fully automatic 125cc is what they're putting in the MaddAss now. I am anxious to try out the fully auto twist and go motor as opposed to my original semi auto.

/

Adjuster · 01-15-2015, 04:27 PM

I was shocked to learn my entire motor is only held to the bike frame by 2 skinny 6" long bolts with no type of rubber motor mount or anything. Simplicity at its best but still surprising. I was able to cradle the motor in 1 arm like a little baby and lift in place and slide the bolts thru and that was it, the motor was replaced.

/

Barnone · 01-15-2015, 04:44 PM

Is this what you are talking about? How is neutral handled?

125CC FULLY AUTO ENGINE
http://www.ebay.com/itm/125CC-FULLY-...-/160733006390

That would be a nice replacement engine if needed for my 110cc 4 Stroke Retro Motor Bike with Cargo Sidecar.
Cargo in this case is an old biker on his last leg.

01-13-2015, 07:14 PM	#1
jjn Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 206	Why no Honda Trail 110 clones? As I was riding my 2009 Kymco People 150 home from Hilo on the highway, I came upon a small motorcycle riding on the shoulder. Turned out to be a bike I've seen around a few times. It's the later version of my first motorcycle I got back when I was 8 years old. A Honda Trail 90. This one I saw was, I believe, a CT-110, as I could tell it was a later model. Now, I happen to know that a mid 60's Trail 90 is capable of hitting about 57 mph (statute of limitations long expired now!) if it's in street gear. On this island, one of these makes a lot of sense. We have LOTS of gravel and dirt and embedded rocky roads. No freeways. Main highways are posted 50-55, and they have very wide shoulders for moped riders, pedestrians, bicyclists. 50+ years ago, I never bothered checking gas mileage, but I bet a good running Trail 90 would get what, 90 mpg? And, they have a pretty good following too. So, why no Chinese clones of the Trail 90/Trail 110? I know about the SYM Symba and the BMS 110cc Metro. And the CT-70 clones (which I do like). Someone like Skyteam could make them using their current 125cc engine that they used in the TRex, CT clone, and the monkey bike models. Some decent suspension travel, a solo seat with sturdy rack, maybe an attached spare gas container (like the CT-110's had I believe). A real front fork, rather than the Earles type, or leading link type front forks. Kick and electric start. Center stand. I bet they'd sell! __________________ Jon, in Keaau, Hawaii
	0

01-14-2015, 11:30 PM	#2
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	Excellent question. It would make a good clone. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	0

01-15-2015, 08:30 AM	#3
katoranger Join Date: May 2007 Location: Altamont, Kansas Posts: 15,103	I would like to see a CT110 clone too. __________________ You meet the nicest people on a Honda Clone.
	0

01-15-2015, 08:34 AM	#4
SpudRider Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Idaho Posts: 25,054	X3; perhaps Zongshen will make one. __________________ Spud "Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level, and beat you with experience." Mark Twain 2015 Zongshen ZS250GY-3 (RX3) 2006 Zongshen ZS200GY-2 (Sierra 200) 2005 Honda XR650L 2004 Honda CRF250X 1998 Kawasaki KDX220 Mods made to my Zongshen ZS200GY-2: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=6894
	0

01-15-2015, 08:37 AM	#5
katoranger Join Date: May 2007 Location: Altamont, Kansas Posts: 15,103	It would get me back on forth to work. I can just ride the gravel and stay off the highway. __________________ You meet the nicest people on a Honda Clone.
	0

01-15-2015, 09:06 AM	#7
Mudflap Join Date: Sep 2014 Posts: 1,870	The only way you're going to hit 57 mph on a trail 90 is in a free fall off a cliff. That may be exaggerating a bit but I've owned several and 45 mph is about all they've got on level ground. Start up a hill or get into a headwind and you're looking at 35 mph. Still, a very light sturdy little bike that can be hauled on a bumper rack and used on and off road is very useful. My solution is to buy a cheap and junky Trail 90 and put a Lifan engine on it. This one has the 140 cc Lifan and will cruise easily at 55. It'll also climb anything it can get traction on.
	0

01-15-2015, 09:09 AM	#8
SpudRider Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Idaho Posts: 25,054	I doubt the Zongshen Rapido will grace our shores; but I also said that about the Zongshen RX3. How about a Honda Grom? http://powersports.honda.com/2014/grom.aspx __________________ Spud "Never argue with an idiot. He will drag you down to his level, and beat you with experience." Mark Twain 2015 Zongshen ZS250GY-3 (RX3) 2006 Zongshen ZS200GY-2 (Sierra 200) 2005 Honda XR650L 2004 Honda CRF250X 1998 Kawasaki KDX220 Mods made to my Zongshen ZS200GY-2: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=6894
	0

01-15-2015, 11:35 AM	#10
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	A Rapido would be cool, but there is something appealing about the vintage Trail 90 vibe. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	0

01-15-2015, 03:42 PM	#12
jjn Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 206	First off, with a 12 year old laying flat on a Trail 90, and going down a hill on 348th in Federal Way, Washington, my trail 90 speedo read 57 mph. Now, 50 years ago, we didn't gps or mini cams. That was at the bottom of the third hill heading west on that street. At 12, I was a whole lot lighter than the 200 pounds I am now. Also, an old friend of mine, right about that time, road (illegally, as he was also about 12) his yellow trail 90 from his place in Federal Way, to Yakima, Washington. I didn't go with him, but, that little bike made it there and back. And, adjuster, how many miles have you put on that bike in the photo so far? Has it been reliable for you? __________________ Jon, in Keaau, Hawaii
	0

01-15-2015, 04:23 PM	#13
Adjuster Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Deerfield Beach FL Posts: 1,410	I have maybe 20 miles on it lol. I am a tinkerer modder so I have been messing with it more than riding it. Any reliability issues I caused myself. For instance I already stripped out the aluminum spark plug hole. Top speed with my weight is 35mph. I need to go around 40 45 in my area. For the speed reason and because I stripped out the spark plug I just purchased a new motor instead of fixing the original. A new 49cc head was going to cost me $65.00, my brand new 125cc motor cost me $205.00 plus $50.00 shipping. So far it has been an easy swap. I still have to loosen the rear wheel to get the chain back on and then I have to install my new carburetor that I purchased for the new motor. I may have some trouble with the carburetor because I want to change it from a reward mount to a forward mount carb. I may not have enough clearance under the fuel tank. I will not say these Chinese bikes are 100% reliable. However with that said anything that breaks is easy to diagnose and cheap and easy to repair. A brand new 125CC motor for $255.00 is just crazy. By the way the fully automatic 125cc is what they're putting in the MaddAss now. I am anxious to try out the fully auto twist and go motor as opposed to my original semi auto. /
	0

01-15-2015, 04:27 PM	#14
Adjuster Join Date: Dec 2014 Location: Deerfield Beach FL Posts: 1,410	I was shocked to learn my entire motor is only held to the bike frame by 2 skinny 6" long bolts with no type of rubber motor mount or anything. Simplicity at its best but still surprising. I was able to cradle the motor in 1 arm like a little baby and lift in place and slide the bolts thru and that was it, the motor was replaced. /
	0

01-15-2015, 04:44 PM	#15
Barnone Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,348	Is this what you are talking about? How is neutral handled? 125CC FULLY AUTO ENGINE http://www.ebay.com/itm/125CC-FULLY-...-/160733006390 That would be a nice replacement engine if needed for my 110cc 4 Stroke Retro Motor Bike with Cargo Sidecar. Cargo in this case is an old biker on his last leg. Last edited by Barnone; 07-13-2019 at 09:14 PM.
	0