1985 Honda elite 150 build thread.

[katoranger]

Buford is easily distracted with food.

[SpudRider]

Originally Posted by katoranger

Buford is easily distracted with food.

That sounds believable.

Spud

[Reveeen]

Originally Posted by katoranger

Found a service manual in PDF form.
http://www.hondaspree.net/other/Elit...nual_85-86.pdf

I linked you to a manual, it was not a "clear" link, as I *thought* those were frowned upon here.

I have never had much luck lubing rusty (internally) cables. They seem, for me, to free up for a time, then get right back into sticking.

[FastDoc]

Originally Posted by SpudRider

That sounds believable.

Spud

:P

[Reveeen]

Originally Posted by katoranger

I think I will need upgrade tires though. I wonder if I could swap a disc brake setup from a china 150 with a 12" wheel and low profile tires.

*generalization alert*

For the most part, Chinese scooters come in 2 sizes, large frame, and small frame. The small frame scooters, like the small frame Japanese, are roughly 5' long, or less. The large frame are over 6' long.
The small frame are set up for 50cc motors, while the large frame are set up for: 50cc motors, 150cc motors, and 250cc motors.
Engine cases come in two sizes: long and short.
The Chinese use a combination of the 2 frame sizes, and case lengths, to make different wheelbase scooters.

For the most part front ends (complete) are interchangeable. There is a small variation in steering head length, and diameter of the stem where the handle bars mount. An angle grinder will remedy the first (remove the bearing cups first!) and a welder will remedy the second (welding your bars, with attached brackets, to the original stem adapter).

Rear wheels (50cc/150cc) have different offsets. (you can use a 50cc wheel on a 150cc motor with a spacer, but not a 150cc wheel on a 50cc motor).

Short case motors are restricted to a 10" wheel (3:50X10 tire 16.5"). A 12 " wheel (120/70/12 tire 18.6") will just go with some engine case grinding (I've seen it, but would not do it myself).

Your liquid cooled Honda engine complete will fit in any Chinese scooter, the large frame being a better choice, using the Honda engine mount. Because it is a vertical engine you will lose the under seat storage.

[katoranger]

I think I would only swap the front. The helix has a similar setup to the elite with a disc brake and 12" wheel.

After I get things going I may research that out more. A hydraulic disc would be a nice upgrade.

Oh, on the cables. New ones are available and pretty cheap. I may get new ones, but so far they are now working fine. Not rusty, just needed use.

[Reveeen]

A 250 Elite/Helix (vertical) motor will bolt into your frame if you like?

I would run the thing, see how it works for you, and make any changes over next winter.

Don't be too hasty in discounting the front suspension you have, you can change the shocks if you feel the old ones are clapped out and re-bush the pivots (Chinese front ends are generally not rebuildable..... they don't sell parts, just complete fork legs).

A disk brake would be nice, but you really aren't going fast enough, if the truth be known.

Like I said: run the thing.... see how it works for you, figure out the stuff you might want to change come winter.

[FastDoc]

Like I said: run the thing.... see how it works for you, figure out the stuff you might want to change come winter.

+1.

Much of the time what seems like a big deal early does not matter once you get used to and 'make friends' with tha machine.

[Weldangrind]

Originally Posted by Reveeen

For the most part, Chinese scooters come in 2 sizes, large frame, and small frame. The small frame scooters, like the small frame Japanese, are roughly 5' long, or less. The large frame are over 6' long.
The small frame are set up for 50cc motors, while the large frame are set up for: 50cc motors, 150cc motors, and 250cc motors.
Engine cases come in two sizes: long and short.
The Chinese use a combination of the 2 frame sizes, and case lengths, to make different wheelbase scooters.

That's excellent information Reveeen. In your studied opinion, if I found a 6' Chinese 50cc scooter, would it likely accept a 150cc GY6? Since a 150 Elite engine would fit into any Chinese scooter, does that mean that a 150cc GY6 would fit into a small frame 50cc Chinese scooter?

[Reveeen]

From what I have seen a 6' Chinese scooter would make it a "large" frame. It will have both sets of tabs on the frame to accept the over, and under, engine mounts, and dual rear shocks. So, virtually any Chinese/Japanese motor will go in there, and likely you will find the rad mounting tabs under the front plastic.

The small frame scooters do not usually have the upper frame tabs for mounting a 150cc GY6 (you would have to get "creative" with making an engine mount), and the spot for the engine is tight on/in the frame (nothing a little "creative" hammer work won't fix), but you could put a vertical Honda Elite 50/150/250cc, and Aero 50cc/80cc/125cc, in there, though you will have to make rad mounts for the liquid cooled choices, and lose the under seat storage. Of course the 100cc 2 stroke ATV (eg. Polaris) engines will fit.

About 1997 Honda switched from vertical to horizontal type engines (to give under seat storage). By this time the scooter "boom" was over (for Honda) and these are rarer than the earlier types.

A 50cc Chinese scooter will either be a small frame., or a large frame scooter. Close to home for you:
http://www.sagacanada.ca/
Retro: http://www.sagacanada.ca/retro-50cc-scooter-fe.asp (small frame)
Quest: http://www.sagacanada.ca/quest-50cc-...scooter-sp.asp (large)
Deluxe: http://www.sagacanada.ca/deluxe-50cc...scooter-fe.asp (large)

I'm starting to believe the "ideal" Chinese scooter would have a Honda 4 stroke in it (for mileage and reliability).

[katoranger]

Reveen, that is all good information to know. I won't be many any changes soon. Most likely to replacement parts on worn items.

The only upgrade I really see is tires. The drum brakes will probably be fine and I will most likely replace the cables with new ones soon too. If this online honda parts place comes through with the few pieces I order I will place another for some cables and a few other things I found that are more cosmetic than urgent.

Oh, I need to check out the wheel bearings and stem bearings too. I forget earlier.

It felt solid on the road for 10 inch tires. Going to ride it around locally to get use to it and make sure all the kinks are worked out before taking the 22 mile ride to the office.

[Reveeen]

I would not expect any "nasty surprises", other than large pot holes, and those afore mentioned 10" tires.

Honda's as a rule are a bit over sprung and under damped in the suspension department. The only way you are going to be able to tell if what you have is right for you is pound the miles to it under different conditions. It is only the odd fool (like myself) that likes to scrape the running (foot) boards.

[katoranger]

Email update. My honda parts should arrive between the 15th and 17th. Alittle slow in my opinion, but at the price was right.

[davidsonsgccc]

sounds like you got a good deal. i know this is a chinabike forum but you cant beat a honda.

if you could find a cheap swap i would reccomend the biggest front wheel you could get. those small wheels take a beating on the pot holes.

what is the projected gas mileage?

[katoranger]

From my research it looks like 65-85mpg. My guess is it depends on the weight of the rider and the type of riding. I think I will get in the higher range as I am 140 and travel at slower speeds. Plus I intend to install a slightly taller rear tire.

I know the roads well that I travel. Fortunately not many potholes.

The other benefit to the honda is a real headlight and not a candle like my lifan.