Initial impression of RX3 for a trail bike rider - Page 5

vickytulla · 11-03-2017, 09:19 AM

but I am glad the bike did make a full return to home on its own I did not throttled it hard after noticing the condition of sprocket just kept soft hand on throttle...

AdventureDad · 11-03-2017, 11:02 AM

Glad you made it home!! How is your bike thought of in Pakistan? It seems nicer than many in your pictures. Is it considered a good bike even though it’s chinese? We get a lot of that in America, people believing because it’s chinese, it’s not good quality.

Jay In Milpitas · 11-03-2017, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vickytulla

So; due to alot of offroading included in this year summer I replaced the front sprocket to 13T instad of stock 14T...

On the way back from this tour I was some what 400kms from my home city when I noticed chain skipped few tooths on heavy accelration...

I thought may be the chain is very loose I might check it on next refueling stop.. so on next refueling stop I saw this.... I was freaked out and thought I might have to get it loaded on some truck... becuase the sprocket had alsmot no tooth...

on my return I got it replaced back to stock sprocket... the mechnic suggestd it got chewed due to very low quality... thanks to Aliexpress.com from where I bought it.....

Very good that you made it home.

Maybe sprocket was not genuine Chinese, maybe counterfeit from Lesotho?

vickytulla · 11-03-2017, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdventureDad

Glad you made it home!! How is your bike thought of in Pakistan?

The bike is the largest engine bike in Pakistan we donot have bike any larger then 150cc/125cc most common are 70cc.

So yes this bike is a head turner for every one as mostly this kind of machine is considered to be some foreigner riding into Himalaya..

Recently like in last half a decade motorcyle adventure touring has gone exponentially high and lot of people are taking interest in larger long route daul purpose bikes..

most elite tend to choose Japanese or BMWs for the purpose (which is 0.0001% of actual local adventure tourist)

where as other who cant afford choose dirt bikes and daul sports as they are cheap and with modifications they make it tour ready...

This bike had a critical reception when I first brought it following you guys closely then its doing good in U.S. and rider find it good out there...

I was center of attention and almost every guy with a daul sports/dirt bike in our clan had a drag race with it... (rx3 win every drag

)

We did noticed it wasnt "that" maneuverable as dirt machine and smaller bikes... but that made sense as it was large and had too much to carry along..

At one point we camped in snow and I was accompanied with Husky; Bmw; xr; dergree and same night it was being discussed that this is a chinese replica it wont last long ang would might create issues in this ery tour..

but in morning bikes were almost frozen and no bike agreed to start and riders were frustrated... while I got out side after putting all gears.. I just put the ky in and pushed self,,, and bike started.... You cannot imagine the faces of all the riders and I danced for like half a minute and we all ahd a good laugh when japs and BMw did nto want to start... we had to push started thm finally...

From that moment on.. you bet the bike has a Repo now.... they know bike has juice..

neverthless the chinese bikes which come here as well are really really bad quality and are use and throw type but yes dirt cheap.. you can buy a chinese 70cc (honda copy) for as low as 90~100$ ,,,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay In Milpitas

Very good that you made it home.

Maybe sprocket was not genuine Chinese, maybe counterfeit from Lesotho?

Not sure if it was lesotho

but it sure was 3rd class qaulity which lasted only one season... if it was orignal zongshen I am sure it never would have happened...

AdventureDad · 11-03-2017, 03:41 PM

Interesting perspective from somewhere in the world I’ll probably sadly never get to visit. I’m glad you are proving to your friends that Chinese bikes aren’t all bad. It’s a shame that the Chinese made so much crap for so long, their reputation will take a decade to recover (if they want it to). Just like Japanese cars did here in the 80’s.

fjmartin · 11-03-2017, 07:34 PM

Thanks, I like making the videos even if they make me look a bit of a fool! I am amazed that the sprocket got eaten up like that. I have 15K miles on my bike and 14K are on a CSC 13T sprocket. It still looks new!

BlackBike · 11-04-2017, 01:49 PM

Sprocket issue, I chock that up to riding off road in the world's highest elevations. Seriously hardcore.

Great stories

pyoungbl · 11-04-2017, 03:35 PM

swapping from 14T to 13T is pretty common on lots of chain drive bikes. It puts much more strain on the chain because the chain has to bend around a tighter radius and there is more pressure on the engaged teeth. Now, these changes are not huge but they are not good for long chain or sprocket life. I hope you changed both sprockets and chain at the same time. If not, you will find that everything will start to wear faster. After all, the worn chain is ever so slightly longer in pin to pin distance. Now the old chain won't be putting even pressure on the sprocket teeth. A smaller number of teeth are carrying the load. This will cause the chain to wear faster and also cause the sprockets to wear faster. Throw in your super challenging riding conditions and.....well, things wear out faster.

With all that said, I wish I could have been on that trip.

Peter Y.

vickytulla · 11-06-2017, 09:32 AM

this all makes a lot of sense and no I have just put the 14T back .. I will have to find a source here to find complete RX3 complaint set first..

hmmmm One Item to bucket before summer now... I wont like chewed final drive next summer as dudes here are already planning to ride towards Himalaya's shiggar (shee-Ger) Valley and ahead which is base of K2 ( second highest peak in the world) ... which is gona be quite interesting..

Quote:

Originally Posted by pyoungbl

swapping from 14T to 13T is pretty common on lots of chain drive bikes. It puts much more strain on the chain because the chain has to bend around a tighter radius and there is more pressure on the engaged teeth. Now, these changes are not huge but they are not good for long chain or sprocket life. I hope you changed both sprockets and chain at the same time. If not, you will find that everything will start to wear faster. After all, the worn chain is ever so slightly longer in pin to pin distance. Now the old chain won't be putting even pressure on the sprocket teeth. A smaller number of teeth are carrying the load. This will cause the chain to wear faster and also cause the sprockets to wear faster. Throw in your super challenging riding conditions and.....well, things wear out faster.

With all that said, I wish I could have been on that trip.

Peter Y.

Jay In Milpitas · 11-06-2017, 08:45 PM

Do you know how to inspect your drive chain for wear?
If it is even a little worn it will destroy your 14T very fast.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vickytulla

this all makes a lot of sense and no I have just put the 14T back .. I will have to find a source here to find complete RX3 complaint set first..

hmmmm One Item to bucket before summer now... I wont like chewed final drive next summer as dudes here are already planning to ride towards Himalaya's shiggar (shee-Ger) Valley and ahead which is base of K2 ( second highest peak in the world) ... which is gona be quite interesting..

vickytulla · 11-07-2017, 06:43 AM

no I actually do not know much about chain... I will have to learn a bit about it I must say...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay In Milpitas

Do you know how to inspect your drive chain for wear?
If it is even a little worn it will destroy your 14T very fast.

Jay In Milpitas · 11-07-2017, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vickytulla

no I actually do not know much about chain... I will have to learn a bit about it I must say...

Here is a good place to start to learn. There are more videos but this one shows a chain in very early wear, but it will damage sprockets.

There is more to this video, I just started where I thought it will help you most.

sqwert · 11-07-2017, 07:38 PM

Jay's video shows good info. Chains generally are heat treated parts, so the plates don't typically stretch. The pins and rollers wear. Lots of pins and rollers, and rollers wear on both sides, so 440 wear spots, each with a tiny bit of wear, adds up to a lot of grief. Probably your only effective solution will be to replace both sprockets and chain. No excuses.

Another way to check chains for wear is a good cleaning, then stretch out on a flat surface, plates perpendicular to the surface and pins parallel. Finger tips at the ends on the side away from you, thumbs on the side towards you, then try to curve the chain along the plates. If the chain curves, it is trash. How much curve? Check the curve on broken chains in the trash bin at any shop. That's too much. When you get a chance, check the curves of new chains. Not much there, eh? Doesn't take many chains to learn from experience to worry. After gaining a bit of experience, you'll be able to pick up a chain, turn the pins vertical, look at the curve of the plates induced by gravity, and pronounce it's condition accurately in about 0.2 seconds. It really is that easy, once you get a little grease under your nails.

What sprockets? Sprockets from proven sources made by proven brands. Too many fraudsters these days to do anything less, you've paid that price.

The bigger the sprockets, the longer they last. Less stress per contact point, less friction and wear from less movement, lower operating temperatures, ... . It adds up. A smaller countershaft sprocket is not the cheap way to lower final drive ratio, as you've found out. Now, since you need to replace both sprockets and chain, invest in good stuff. The better way to lower final drive ratio is a bigger wheel sprocket and longer chain.

However, seems the sprocket sizes available are extremely limited.

Here's how it works. Stock on my old, stock TW is 14/50, or ~3.571:1, and a junk open chain that wore out after 6000 miles with twice weekly adjustments, cleanings, and lube. Now I run 15/54, or 3.6:1, and an aftermarket ringed chain on sale. Not enough difference to even notice, until time for chain maintenance. Once a month or so, and after dirt rides, the chain gets a spray of Deep Creep. Deep Creep flows off the dirt, then dries, making a water proof and rust preventative layer. Takes about 2 minutes.

Even though the ringed chain cost twice the stock open chain, I save more money in cleaning and lubing products with the o-ring chain to more than make up the difference. Toss in the price of sprockets and hardware every 6000 miles the cheap chain would have cost about 5 times as much as doing it right, and the o-ring set up is still going strong.

STOCK
9 CS Sprocket
28 W Sprocket
21 open chain
9 sprocket hardware
19 2 cans Deep Creep
16 2 cans chain lube
102 dollars every 6000 miles

15 CS sprocket
28 w sprocket
60 ringed chain
9 sprocket hardware
19 2cans Deep Creep
131 dollars every 30,000 miles

You're worth the best, and should not have anything less considering the remoteness of your riding. Considering the best is not really that much an investment, that's the better way to go. Even lots cheaper.

Oh, I forgot, add $60 to 30,000 miles with the cheap parts for oil--on a TW it has to be changed when accessing the countershaft sprocket. In real life, the o-ring on bigger sprockets is only 16 more to invest.

vickytulla · 11-08-2017, 04:32 AM

hmmm very very interesting... they way this guy checked the "play" in old chain the losings which is in old chain that can be checked rather quite quickly...

Thanks Jay

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jay In Milpitas

Here is a good place to start to learn. There are more videos but this one shows a chain in very early wear, but it will damage sprockets.

There is more to this video, I just started where I thought it will help you most.

pyoungbl · 11-08-2017, 11:25 AM

The chains that come on the RX3 are "O" ring type but, as Joe has written in his book 5,000 miles at 8,000 rpm they tend to only last about 5,000 miles. That's why I installed a high quality aftermarket chain almost immediately after getting my bike. Now, at almost 6K miles, my chain and sprockets look like new.

11-03-2017, 09:19 AM	#61
vickytulla Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Lahore Posts: 186	but I am glad the bike did make a full return to home on its own I did not throttled it hard after noticing the condition of sprocket just kept soft hand on throttle... __________________ Prime RX3 from Pakistan - Adventure Touring# RX3 - 2017 - Dirt Machine# FSE-450 - 2022 - Classic# Honda CD175 - 1977 - Daily Runner# 1992 - CG125 (engine swap CB250 Sleeper) - Project#1 : 1995 - Honda C70 w/ 180cc engine swap
	1

11-03-2017, 07:34 PM	#66
fjmartin Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Redmond, WA. Posts: 534	Thanks, I like making the videos even if they make me look a bit of a fool! I am amazed that the sprocket got eaten up like that. I have 15K miles on my bike and 14K are on a CSC 13T sprocket. It still looks new! __________________ 2017 BMW F800GS Adventure
	1

11-04-2017, 01:49 PM	#67
BlackBike Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: George West, Texas Posts: 4,097	Sprocket issue, I chock that up to riding off road in the world's highest elevations. Seriously hardcore. Great stories __________________ ***************************************** 2015 Bashan"Blaze" BS250GY-31 (DB-07K-250) GONE 2017 Suzuki V Strom 650 XT "We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid." ~Benjamin Franklin~
	1

11-03-2017, 11:02 AM	#62
AdventureDad Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: South Mississippi Posts: 253	Glad you made it home!! How is your bike thought of in Pakistan? It seems nicer than many in your pictures. Is it considered a good bike even though it’s chinese? We get a lot of that in America, people believing because it’s chinese, it’s not good quality.
	0

11-03-2017, 03:41 PM	#65
AdventureDad Join Date: Apr 2016 Location: South Mississippi Posts: 253	Interesting perspective from somewhere in the world I’ll probably sadly never get to visit. I’m glad you are proving to your friends that Chinese bikes aren’t all bad. It’s a shame that the Chinese made so much crap for so long, their reputation will take a decade to recover (if they want it to). Just like Japanese cars did here in the 80’s.
	1

11-04-2017, 03:35 PM	#68
pyoungbl Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Portsmouth, Virginia, USA Posts: 632	swapping from 14T to 13T is pretty common on lots of chain drive bikes. It puts much more strain on the chain because the chain has to bend around a tighter radius and there is more pressure on the engaged teeth. Now, these changes are not huge but they are not good for long chain or sprocket life. I hope you changed both sprockets and chain at the same time. If not, you will find that everything will start to wear faster. After all, the worn chain is ever so slightly longer in pin to pin distance. Now the old chain won't be putting even pressure on the sprocket teeth. A smaller number of teeth are carrying the load. This will cause the chain to wear faster and also cause the sprockets to wear faster. Throw in your super challenging riding conditions and.....well, things wear out faster. With all that said, I wish I could have been on that trip. Peter Y.
	2

11-07-2017, 07:38 PM	#73
sqwert Join Date: Jun 2017 Posts: 382	Jay's video shows good info. Chains generally are heat treated parts, so the plates don't typically stretch. The pins and rollers wear. Lots of pins and rollers, and rollers wear on both sides, so 440 wear spots, each with a tiny bit of wear, adds up to a lot of grief. Probably your only effective solution will be to replace both sprockets and chain. No excuses. Another way to check chains for wear is a good cleaning, then stretch out on a flat surface, plates perpendicular to the surface and pins parallel. Finger tips at the ends on the side away from you, thumbs on the side towards you, then try to curve the chain along the plates. If the chain curves, it is trash. How much curve? Check the curve on broken chains in the trash bin at any shop. That's too much. When you get a chance, check the curves of new chains. Not much there, eh? Doesn't take many chains to learn from experience to worry. After gaining a bit of experience, you'll be able to pick up a chain, turn the pins vertical, look at the curve of the plates induced by gravity, and pronounce it's condition accurately in about 0.2 seconds. It really is that easy, once you get a little grease under your nails. What sprockets? Sprockets from proven sources made by proven brands. Too many fraudsters these days to do anything less, you've paid that price. The bigger the sprockets, the longer they last. Less stress per contact point, less friction and wear from less movement, lower operating temperatures, ... . It adds up. A smaller countershaft sprocket is not the cheap way to lower final drive ratio, as you've found out. Now, since you need to replace both sprockets and chain, invest in good stuff. The better way to lower final drive ratio is a bigger wheel sprocket and longer chain. However, seems the sprocket sizes available are extremely limited. Here's how it works. Stock on my old, stock TW is 14/50, or ~3.571:1, and a junk open chain that wore out after 6000 miles with twice weekly adjustments, cleanings, and lube. Now I run 15/54, or 3.6:1, and an aftermarket ringed chain on sale. Not enough difference to even notice, until time for chain maintenance. Once a month or so, and after dirt rides, the chain gets a spray of Deep Creep. Deep Creep flows off the dirt, then dries, making a water proof and rust preventative layer. Takes about 2 minutes. Even though the ringed chain cost twice the stock open chain, I save more money in cleaning and lubing products with the o-ring chain to more than make up the difference. Toss in the price of sprockets and hardware every 6000 miles the cheap chain would have cost about 5 times as much as doing it right, and the o-ring set up is still going strong. STOCK 9 CS Sprocket 28 W Sprocket 21 open chain 9 sprocket hardware 19 2 cans Deep Creep 16 2 cans chain lube 102 dollars every 6000 miles 15 CS sprocket 28 w sprocket 60 ringed chain 9 sprocket hardware 19 2cans Deep Creep 131 dollars every 30,000 miles You're worth the best, and should not have anything less considering the remoteness of your riding. Considering the best is not really that much an investment, that's the better way to go. Even lots cheaper. Oh, I forgot, add $60 to 30,000 miles with the cheap parts for oil--on a TW it has to be changed when accessing the countershaft sprocket. In real life, the o-ring on bigger sprockets is only 16 more to invest.
	1

11-08-2017, 11:25 AM	#75
pyoungbl Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Portsmouth, Virginia, USA Posts: 632	The chains that come on the RX3 are "O" ring type but, as Joe has written in his book 5,000 miles at 8,000 rpm they tend to only last about 5,000 miles. That's why I installed a high quality aftermarket chain almost immediately after getting my bike. Now, at almost 6K miles, my chain and sprockets look like new.
	3