Who killed the electric car?

Alaskan-Dad · 11-08-2008, 02:14 PM

Anyone ever hear of or see the documentary movie:

Who killed the electric car?
A lack of consumer confidence... or conspiracy?
Available on DVD from Sony Pictures

This documentary should be required watching for all drivers!
I was amazed at the history of EV Electric Vehicles,
They sure did a great job of hiding them from the general public!

Grrrr............ oiled again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Quote:

Amazon
Editorial Reviews
Amazon.com
It begins with a solemn funeralâ€¦for a car. By the end of Chris Paine's lively and informative documentary, the idea doesn't seem quite so strange. As narrator Martin Sheen notes, "They were quiet and fast, produced no exhaust and ran without gasoline." Paine proceeds to show how this unique vehicle came into being and why General Motors ended up reclaiming its once-prized creation less than a decade later. He begins 100 years ago with the original electric car. By the 1920s, the internal-combustion engine had rendered it obsolete. By the 1980s, however, car companies started exploring alternative energy sources, like solar power. This, in turn, led to the late, great battery-powered EV1. Throughout, Paine deftly translates hard science and complex politics, such as California's Zero-Emission Vehicle Mandate, into lay person's terms (director Alex Gibney, Oscar-nominated for Enron: The Smartest Guys in the Room, served as consulting producer). And everyone gets the chance to have their say: engineers, politicians, protesters, and petroleum spokespeople--even celebrity drivers, like Peter Horton, Alexandra Paul, and a wild man beard-sporting Mel Gibson. But the most persuasive participant is former Saturn employee Chelsea Sexton. Promoting the benefits of the EV1 was more than a job to her, and she continues to lobby for more environmentally friendly options. Sexton provides the small ray of hope Paine's film so desperately needs. Who Killed the Electric Car? is, otherwise, a tremendously sobering experience. --Kathleen C. Fennessy

Who Killed the Electric Car? (2006)
Starring: Martin Sheen Rating: Format: DVD

Price: $9.99

link Amazon
Sony info on EV's

Qingdao · 11-08-2008, 05:56 PM

Horse power to weight killed the electric car.

Alaskan-Dad · 11-08-2008, 06:40 PM

That was not the problem 10 yrs ago when several major car companies had EV's zipping around Cali.
And surely not a problem today
500bhp electric car

Mel Gibson drove a GMC EV-1 until they manipulated a recall and crushed all the EV's. The EV's were leased not sold which made it easy for the manufacturers to take them back even though most leasers wanted to keep their EV's!
Ford, Toyota and GMC sold EV's in Cali. all were destroyed by the manufactures.
If you ever see the movie you'll be amazed at the vehicles that were sold and ran in California! Also you'll be very angry a the $$$ you've been giving to the oil barrons!
Save the oil for gas for important things like air travel and of course motorcycles :wink:
If you dl torrents there is a torrent file of the full movie being shared
Someone donated the movie to our town library is how I got to see it

warrior91 · 11-08-2008, 08:41 PM

I am sure you guys saw this one...No power to weight issue here!

Alaskan-Dad · 11-09-2008, 12:25 PM

warrior91,
Quick bike 0 to 60 mph @.97seconds 158 mph @ 1/4 mile
lithium ion batteries with nano technology, interesting 8)
next time the inventor should let the driver ride the bike!

Maybe Obama will bail out our car industry by making some laws to promote electric vehicles.
I know I'd like a plug in hybrid,
in my dream$,
maybe when they are 20yrs old I'll be able to afford a used one.

I got hit hard by gas prices this year @ $4.86 for the summer high and $4.22 last time I bought gas. Really put the hurt on my fishing and hunting the freezer is not full going into this winter :(
But I got bikes for next year :wink:

VinceDrake · 11-09-2008, 02:35 PM

Just as an aside, GM's own dealerships *hated* the electric-cars. Not only was the mark-up pitiful, once they left the dealer ship, they never come back. i.e. No oil changes, no tune-ups, No injector purges, etc. Maybe some tires and a set of wiper blades once in a while.

With many factors putting the squeeze on new-car profit margins, the money is in the service, and there was really no service on the EV1.

Come to think of it, being a mechanic, I hate electric cars! Although, I strongly doubt they'll ever make a lto of noise here in Sask, with our climate...

--Vince

SpeedSouth · 11-09-2008, 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VinceDrake

Just as an aside, GM's own dealerships *hated* the electric-cars. Not only was the mark-up pitiful, once they left the dealer ship, they never come back. i.e. No oil changes, no tune-ups, No injector purges, etc. Maybe some tires and a set of wiper blades once in a while.

With many factors putting the squeeze on new-car profit margins, the money is in the service, and there was really no service on the EV1.

Come to think of it, being a mechanic, I hate electric cars! Although, I strongly doubt they'll ever make a lto of noise here in Sask, with our climate...

--Vince

That reminds me of something I posted here several months ago about the parts and service industry not being fully in support of alternative energy sources. Obviously that doesn't apply to everyone who services vehicles, but it does have some impact.

If I remember correctly, the argument than was...the service shops will simply train and learn the new technology. And that's fine, but on vehicles with fewer moving or servicable parts, the opportunity for service is greatly reduced.

I agree that the movie in question is one that everyone needs to see. I don't consider every statement in the movie to be a fact, but much of it is also supported by evidence elsewhere.

IronFist · 11-09-2008, 07:40 PM

Quebec has a few electric car manufacturers, oddly enough. Even Quebec hydro was in on it. Putting the motor in the wheels saves a lot of energy, with direct transfer. The sticking point for electric vehicles is the battery. A battery that's fast to charge, slow to discharge, lite and small hasn't happened yet. Well not without inproper heat transfer starting fires in the car.

One Quebec company just got the permission to sell cars in Canada! Till now they had to export all their cars. They couldn't meet the crash safety standards for highway. Yet, their car can't go on the highway, it's a city car that tops out at 50Kph. They finally said ok to a pilot, electric car class, project.

Qingdao · 11-10-2008, 04:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warrior91

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZfueVHVnkI

I am sure you guys saw this one...No power to weight issue here!

Electric bike $40000 plus sponsers (lord knows how much those batteries cost.)
massive 619#s
8.16 Quater mile

SUZUKI GSXR1000 $11000
379#s (158hp stock)
9.7 stock

I HAVE KNOW IDEA WHY PEOPLE BUY GAS POWERED THINGS :?:

Alaskan-Dad · 11-10-2008, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Qingdao

Quote:

Originally Posted by warrior91

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-ZfueVHVnkI

I am sure you guys saw this one...No power to weight issue here!

Electric bike $40000 plus sponsers (lord knows how much those batteries cost.)
massive 619#s
8.16 Quater mile

SUZUKI GSXR1000 $11000
379#s (158hp stock)
9.7 stock

I HAVE KNOW IDEA WHY PEOPLE BUY GAS POWERED THINGS :?:

SUZUKI GSXR1000 $11000
But how much was spent on the first SUZUKI GSXR1000 prototype?

I don't think it is a fair comparison between a one of a kind prototype and a production bike. :wink:
I have no use for the Kilocycycle drag bike,
I'll wait for the Chinese to make EV-Enduros LOL

VinceDrake · 11-11-2008, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronFist

One Quebec company just got the permission to sell cars in Canada! Till now they had to export all their cars. They couldn't meet the crash safety standards for highway. Yet, their car can't go on the highway, it's a city car that tops out at 50Kph. They finally said ok to a pilot, electric car class, project.

Also currently available, The Zenn Car! The made in Canada, Made by Canadians, owned by Canadians Car that you can't buy in Canada! www.zenncars.com

Manufactured in Toronto. Currently legal in Vancouver and Victoria. Nowhere else in the country.

--Vince

Alaskan-Dad · 11-13-2008, 12:41 PM

The prototype was $350,000
Cars are currently selling at $109,000
The 100% electric 2008 Tesla Roadster
0-60 mph in 3.9 seconds
A 14,000 rpm redline
And 244 miles per charge, thus costing about two cents per mile
Tesla homepage

compare to
Porsche 911 GT2 530 hp @ 6,500 rpm
0-60 mph: 3.6 s

MSRP: $ 194,000.00
This is one of the most expensive Porsche's
so it might be the fairest comparison.

winwun · 11-13-2008, 07:03 PM

The consumer is going to go for the lowest OVERALL cost per mile, and in the case of the E-car, battery replacement and E-car life figure heavily into the cost per mile.

Manufacturers are too greedy, trading on the novelty aspect, the political aspect (green) and the apparent initial cost savings, and they rarely ever tell the whole truth about what it costs to operate the E-car.

Untill we get some ethics in the business, the E-car is dead before it is born.

Jim · 11-15-2008, 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VinceDrake

Quote:

Originally Posted by IronFist

One Quebec company just got the permission to sell cars in Canada! Till now they had to export all their cars. They couldn't meet the crash safety standards for highway. Yet, their car can't go on the highway, it's a city car that tops out at 50Kph. They finally said ok to a pilot, electric car class, project.

Also currently available, The Zenn Car! The made in Canada, Made by Canadians, owned by Canadians Car that you can't buy in Canada! www.zenncars.com

Manufactured in Toronto. Currently legal in Vancouver and Victoria. Nowhere else in the country.

--Vince

Looking at that seems like it could work for some people, and it isn't too pricey...

However it is limited to a top speed of 25mph, and only 35 - 50 miles range, taking 8 hours to recharge.

Jim · 11-15-2008, 10:18 PM

Here's a page about GM's volt, http://gm-volt.com/chevy-volt-faqs/

It sounds better in my opinion, but it seems pricey to me, then again, compared to a hybrid I guess it isn't ?

11-08-2008, 05:56 PM	#2
Qingdao Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Charleston, SC Posts: 351	Horse power to weight killed the electric car. __________________ <div><a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2ilH...s</a></div><br />
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11-08-2008, 06:40 PM	#3
Alaskan-Dad Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Thorne Bay SE Alaska Posts: 131	That was not the problem 10 yrs ago when several major car companies had EV's zipping around Cali. And surely not a problem today 500bhp electric car Mel Gibson drove a GMC EV-1 until they manipulated a recall and crushed all the EV's. The EV's were leased not sold which made it easy for the manufacturers to take them back even though most leasers wanted to keep their EV's! Ford, Toyota and GMC sold EV's in Cali. all were destroyed by the manufactures. If you ever see the movie you'll be amazed at the vehicles that were sold and ran in California! Also you'll be very angry a the $$$ you've been giving to the oil barrons! Save the oil for gas for important things like air travel and of course motorcycles :wink: If you dl torrents there is a torrent file of the full movie being shared Someone donated the movie to our town library is how I got to see it __________________ Three Greys Lifan GY-5's
	0

11-08-2008, 08:41 PM	#4
warrior91 Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: N.E. Saskatchewan, Canada Posts: 679	I am sure you guys saw this one...No power to weight issue here! __________________ '91 Yamaha Warrior- stage 2 '83 Honda ATC 70 '08 Yongjiang 125cc mx (Loncin) '08 Yongjiang 150cc atv (Jinlong)
	0

11-09-2008, 12:25 PM	#5
Alaskan-Dad Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Thorne Bay SE Alaska Posts: 131	warrior91, Quick bike 0 to 60 mph @.97seconds 158 mph @ 1/4 mile lithium ion batteries with nano technology, interesting 8) next time the inventor should let the driver ride the bike! Maybe Obama will bail out our car industry by making some laws to promote electric vehicles. I know I'd like a plug in hybrid, in my dream$, maybe when they are 20yrs old I'll be able to afford a used one. I got hit hard by gas prices this year @ $4.86 for the summer high and $4.22 last time I bought gas. Really put the hurt on my fishing and hunting the freezer is not full going into this winter :( But I got bikes for next year :wink: __________________ Three Greys Lifan GY-5's
	0

11-09-2008, 02:35 PM	#6
VinceDrake Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Southern Saskatchewan Posts: 491	Just as an aside, GM's own dealerships *hated* the electric-cars. Not only was the mark-up pitiful, once they left the dealer ship, they never come back. i.e. No oil changes, no tune-ups, No injector purges, etc. Maybe some tires and a set of wiper blades once in a while. With many factors putting the squeeze on new-car profit margins, the money is in the service, and there was really no service on the EV1. Come to think of it, being a mechanic, I hate electric cars! Although, I strongly doubt they'll ever make a lto of noise here in Sask, with our climate... --Vince __________________ "Sometimes it is better to say nothing, and let people think you're an idiot, than to open your mouth and prove it."
	0

11-09-2008, 07:40 PM	#8
IronFist Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Toronto Ontario Canada Posts: 2,585	Quebec has a few electric car manufacturers, oddly enough. Even Quebec hydro was in on it. Putting the motor in the wheels saves a lot of energy, with direct transfer. The sticking point for electric vehicles is the battery. A battery that's fast to charge, slow to discharge, lite and small hasn't happened yet. Well not without inproper heat transfer starting fires in the car. One Quebec company just got the permission to sell cars in Canada! Till now they had to export all their cars. They couldn't meet the crash safety standards for highway. Yet, their car can't go on the highway, it's a city car that tops out at 50Kph. They finally said ok to a pilot, electric car class, project. __________________ IronFist ___________________________________ The "chain" of command is used for beating spammers. ___________________________________
	0

11-13-2008, 12:41 PM	#12
Alaskan-Dad Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Thorne Bay SE Alaska Posts: 131	The prototype was $350,000 Cars are currently selling at $109,000 The 100% electric 2008 Tesla Roadster 0-60 mph in 3.9 seconds A 14,000 rpm redline And 244 miles per charge, thus costing about two cents per mile Tesla homepage compare to Porsche 911 GT2 530 hp @ 6,500 rpm 0-60 mph: 3.6 s MSRP: $ 194,000.00 This is one of the most expensive Porsche's so it might be the fairest comparison. __________________ Three Greys Lifan GY-5's
	0

11-13-2008, 07:03 PM	#13
winwun Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 169	The consumer is going to go for the lowest OVERALL cost per mile, and in the case of the E-car, battery replacement and E-car life figure heavily into the cost per mile. Manufacturers are too greedy, trading on the novelty aspect, the political aspect (green) and the apparent initial cost savings, and they rarely ever tell the whole truth about what it costs to operate the E-car. Untill we get some ethics in the business, the E-car is dead before it is born. __________________ If everyone picked up a couple of pieces of litter, pretty soon there wouldn't be ANY, and wouldn't THAT be nice ? Luke, 11: 21
	0

11-15-2008, 10:18 PM	#15
Jim Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Abbotsford, BC, Canada Posts: 4,880	Here's a page about GM's volt, http://gm-volt.com/chevy-volt-faqs/ It sounds better in my opinion, but it seems pricey to me, then again, compared to a hybrid I guess it isn't ? __________________ "Be excellent to each other" "We are all human. Let's start to prove it!"
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