Rear brake issue - Page 2

BigDukeSix · 12-28-2018, 08:06 AM

No update yet. I live in Montana so as this isn't prime riding season here. I have just kind of let this project sit as I'm frustrated by it and can't ride the bike right now anyway. Will probably pick it up again in the next week or two. Will post again when I make some progress.

Bruces · 12-28-2018, 08:57 AM

Just a very very minor correction for you ,the screws and bolts are not made out of cheese ,they are however made out of margarine of the “I can’t believe it’s not butter “variety .There is no milk harmed in the making of those screws and bolts ,just a little plastic .

NzBrakelathes · 12-28-2018, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigDukeSix

No update yet. I live in Montana so as this isn't prime riding season here. I have just kind of let this project sit as I'm frustrated by it and can't ride the bike right now anyway. Will probably pick it up again in the next week or two. Will post again when I make some progress.

I was in Montana a couple few months back - light snow that morning and YEAH I wouldn't call that riding season either lol.

dannybiker · 01-24-2019, 06:29 PM

I'm having a recurring issue with the back brake on my bike. It keeps jamming on.
It happened first about a year ago luckily on a short ride near home. The bike started to feel more and more gutless and finally I twigged it wasn't the engine but the brake. When I stopped the rear disc was so hot it had changed colour and was smoking. I could feel the heat radiating from it through my pants.

I immediately checked the pedal and master cylinder both seemed to be solid. I unbolted the master cylinder and checked all the linkages and the problem had disappeared. The bike went great for a couple of months then mid ride the bike started to slow and I immediately stopped to check the brake. Once again the rear disc was steaming. I unbolted the master cylinder and the brake released. Everything was fine for another couple of month riding then a month ago it happened again mid ride. I had noticed the pedal was really hard at the start of the ride and so pushed it really hard a couple of times and suddenly it seemed to unstick and the brake released and everything was fine.

When I got home I took a close look at the master cylinder and under the rubber cover where the pedal pushes the piston the cylinder walls had a coating of rust. The piston had jammed in the rusty cylinder jamming the brakes on.

Lots of CRC later the piston was moving freely again. Could this be the problem? Rust seizing the piston until a few good jabs of the pedal free things up for a while.

I'm going to strip the whole set up this weekend as I'm a bit nervous going on long rides until I'm sure its 100%.

NzBrakelathes · 01-24-2019, 07:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dannybiker

I'm having a recurring issue with the back brake on my bike. It keeps jamming on.
It happened first about a year ago luckily on a short ride near home. The bike started to feel more and more gutless and finally I twigged it wasn't the engine but the brake. When I stopped the rear disc was so hot it had changed colour and was smoking. I could feel the heat radiating from it through my pants.

I immediately checked the pedal and master cylinder both seemed to be solid. I unbolted the master cylinder and checked all the linkages and the problem had disappeared. The bike went great for a couple of months then mid ride the bike started to slow and I immediately stopped to check the brake. Once again the rear disc was steaming. I unbolted the master cylinder and the brake released. Everything was fine for another couple of month riding then a month ago it happened again mid ride. I had noticed the pedal was really hard at the start of the ride and so pushed it really hard a couple of times and suddenly it seemed to unstick and the brake released and everything was fine.

When I got home I took a close look at the master cylinder and under the rubber cover where the pedal pushes the piston the cylinder walls had a coating of rust. The piston had jammed in the rusty cylinder jamming the brakes on.

Lots of CRC later the piston was moving freely again. Could this be the problem? Rust seizing the piston until a few good jabs of the pedal free things up for a while.

I'm going to strip the whole set up this weekend as I'm a bit nervous going on long rides until I'm sure its 100%.

It might pay worst case to replace the master cylinder if you can't 100% repair it - I can supply if needed or CSC

calvarez · 01-25-2019, 08:57 AM

You definitely should replace the master cylinder. It's probably pretty cheap.

BigDukeSix · 01-25-2019, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by calvarez

You definitely should replace the master cylinder. It's probably pretty cheap.

Yeah, it's like $58. Not terribly cheap, but not the end of the world either. Been focusing my efforts on putting a batwing and lowers on my other bike - will get back to this eventually before riding season...

fjmartin · 01-25-2019, 07:07 PM

This issue can occur if the pedal adjustment is too tight. This means that the brake can drag, building heat and then the fluid will expand. As it expands it rubs even more and creates more heat and expands more....until it can seize Eventually it will boil the fluid, glaze the rotor and crack up the pads. You need to check the recommended minimum pedal throw before engagement of the plunger into the master cylinder. If you open the fluid reservoir, check that it's still clear-ish. It can turn black when it gets overly hot.

NzBrakelathes · 01-25-2019, 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigDukeSix

Yeah, it's like $58. Not terribly cheap, but not the end of the world either. Been focusing my efforts on putting a batwing and lowers on my other bike - will get back to this eventually before riding season...

I can supply a master to your door $39.50 via postage from china
Just saying etc

dannybiker · 02-03-2019, 10:08 PM

The latest update, I took the rear caliper off on Friday to discover 1. the pads were almost worn out and 2. one of the two posts which guide the pads and keep them aligned was totally seized in the caliper body. It took a hammer and a cold chisel to free it and some quite serious de-gumming and sanding to free everything up again. Definitely calls for some copperslip or similar when it all goes together again.

The jammed shaft explains the progressive drag issue, as soon as the pads heated up the solid shaft made everything worse instead of letting the pads move out they were held against the disk gradually getting hotter and hotter.

Good news, the local Honda agent was able to order me new pads without any hassles. evidently the same calipers are used on a whole range of their bikes.
More info when it's all back together and working properly.

Azhule · 02-04-2019, 12:58 PM

Don't know where you are at in the world, but if you have brake caliper pin/guide and lube issues, AGS Sil Glyde is another good option... in my area, the AGS brand is one of the few brands the Honda Dealerships trust to use on these kinds of brake jobs

https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_7651351

NzBrakelathes · 02-05-2019, 01:55 AM

That front pin the bolt one seizes easily
Found that on a few bikes
Pads are not expensive genuine and I can buy some cheap crap for under $3 but wouldn’t try or sell that - waste of time etc

pete · 02-05-2019, 03:16 AM

The first think you need to do is.....

if you have to pump it to get peddle pressure....
there a 99% chance there is air in the system..

get rid of the air before you spend money on parts you most lightly don't need..

..

BigDukeSix · 02-05-2019, 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

The first think you need to do is.....

if you have to pump it to get peddle pressure....
there a 99% chance there is air in the system..

get rid of the air before you spend money on parts you most lightly don't need..

..

Yeah, this is what my plan was when I stripped out the screw on the master cylinder. Still haven't dealt with this yet, but it's -4 outside right now in the middle of the day and I think this is about the warmest it's going to be for the next week - so I figure I've got some more time to straighten it out

.

dannybiker · 02-06-2019, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NzBrakelathes

That front pin the bolt one seizes easily
Found that on a few bikes
Pads are not expensive genuine and I can buy some cheap crap for under $3 but wouldn’t try or sell that - waste of time etc

As soon as I get my real estate licence and start selling houses I'm planning a serious order of parts from you.

Total career change at 50 might not be everyone's idea of fun but I decided now or never. Things are going well but cash is a bit scarce!

"Back" to the brakes, I reassembled them yesterday afternoon, and taking super care got the two screws out of the master cylinder and have bled the system. The brake fluid in the sight glass looked a little suspect so I pumped a lot of new clean fluid through before sealing it all up again. My little hint is get a small disposable syringe for filling the master cylinder. It is tiny, and at an angle which makes pouring in fluid impossible.

Now with the whole set up lubricated with silicon goop and all the threads and bushes shiny clean I've just got to wait for the rain to stop so I can go for a ride

01-24-2019, 06:29 PM	#19
dannybiker Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 26	Mine too - but different I'm having a recurring issue with the back brake on my bike. It keeps jamming on. It happened first about a year ago luckily on a short ride near home. The bike started to feel more and more gutless and finally I twigged it wasn't the engine but the brake. When I stopped the rear disc was so hot it had changed colour and was smoking. I could feel the heat radiating from it through my pants. I immediately checked the pedal and master cylinder both seemed to be solid. I unbolted the master cylinder and checked all the linkages and the problem had disappeared. The bike went great for a couple of months then mid ride the bike started to slow and I immediately stopped to check the brake. Once again the rear disc was steaming. I unbolted the master cylinder and the brake released. Everything was fine for another couple of month riding then a month ago it happened again mid ride. I had noticed the pedal was really hard at the start of the ride and so pushed it really hard a couple of times and suddenly it seemed to unstick and the brake released and everything was fine. When I got home I took a close look at the master cylinder and under the rubber cover where the pedal pushes the piston the cylinder walls had a coating of rust. The piston had jammed in the rusty cylinder jamming the brakes on. Lots of CRC later the piston was moving freely again. Could this be the problem? Rust seizing the piston until a few good jabs of the pedal free things up for a while. I'm going to strip the whole set up this weekend as I'm a bit nervous going on long rides until I'm sure its 100%.
	1

01-25-2019, 07:07 PM	#23
fjmartin Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Redmond, WA. Posts: 534	This issue can occur if the pedal adjustment is too tight. This means that the brake can drag, building heat and then the fluid will expand. As it expands it rubs even more and creates more heat and expands more....until it can seize Eventually it will boil the fluid, glaze the rotor and crack up the pads. You need to check the recommended minimum pedal throw before engagement of the plunger into the master cylinder. If you open the fluid reservoir, check that it's still clear-ish. It can turn black when it gets overly hot. __________________ 2017 BMW F800GS Adventure
	3

02-03-2019, 10:08 PM	#25
dannybiker Join Date: Feb 2017 Posts: 26	Brakes broken The latest update, I took the rear caliper off on Friday to discover 1. the pads were almost worn out and 2. one of the two posts which guide the pads and keep them aligned was totally seized in the caliper body. It took a hammer and a cold chisel to free it and some quite serious de-gumming and sanding to free everything up again. Definitely calls for some copperslip or similar when it all goes together again. The jammed shaft explains the progressive drag issue, as soon as the pads heated up the solid shaft made everything worse instead of letting the pads move out they were held against the disk gradually getting hotter and hotter. Good news, the local Honda agent was able to order me new pads without any hassles. evidently the same calipers are used on a whole range of their bikes. More info when it's all back together and working properly.
	2

02-04-2019, 12:58 PM	#26
Azhule Join Date: Dec 2015 Location: CO Posts: 1,525	Don't know where you are at in the world, but if you have brake caliper pin/guide and lube issues, AGS Sil Glyde is another good option... in my area, the AGS brand is one of the few brands the Honda Dealerships trust to use on these kinds of brake jobs https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_7651351 __________________ "Think as you like... but this self proclaimed Professor is always right" - Buckshot "You never know what someone is hiding beneath their smile..." - NinjaTom - R.I.P.
	1

02-05-2019, 03:16 AM	#28
pete Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: ChCh , NZ Posts: 2,261	The first think you need to do is..... if you have to pump it to get peddle pressure.... there a 99% chance there is air in the system.. get rid of the air before you spend money on parts you most lightly don't need.. .. __________________ 09 XT660R ... 06 TTR250 ... 80 Montesa H6 125 Enduro... 77 Montesa Cota 348 MRR "Malcom Rathnell Replica"... Current resto projects.. 81 Honda CT110... 80 Kawasaki KL250A1... 11 Husaburg TE125 enduro... "sold" along with another 31... Lifan 125 Pitbike.. "stolen" ... KIWI BIKER FORUM...... http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/content.php All the best offroad rides in NZ... http://www.remotemoto.com/ E-mail... xtpete1@gmail.com
	0

12-28-2018, 08:06 AM	#16
BigDukeSix Join Date: Apr 2018 Location: Montana Posts: 46	No update yet. I live in Montana so as this isn't prime riding season here. I have just kind of let this project sit as I'm frustrated by it and can't ride the bike right now anyway. Will probably pick it up again in the next week or two. Will post again when I make some progress.
	0

12-28-2018, 08:57 AM	#17
Bruces Join Date: May 2018 Posts: 1,566	Just a very very minor correction for you ,the screws and bolts are not made out of cheese ,they are however made out of margarine of the “I can’t believe it’s not butter “variety .There is no milk harmed in the making of those screws and bolts ,just a little plastic .
	3

01-25-2019, 08:57 AM	#21
calvarez Join Date: Sep 2018 Location: Peoria, AZ Posts: 334	You definitely should replace the master cylinder. It's probably pretty cheap.
	0

02-05-2019, 01:55 AM	#27
NzBrakelathes Join Date: Jun 2016 Location: Hell Posts: 2,408	That front pin the bolt one seizes easily Found that on a few bikes Pads are not expensive genuine and I can buy some cheap crap for under $3 but wouldn’t try or sell that - waste of time etc
	0