Started working on the Jialing 200cc

TommyD · 01-06-2018, 04:34 PM

Well, today I finally started working on the Jialing that I was told (by the seller) had probably thrown a push rod.

I went to remove the cover but it wouldn't clear the frame so I peeked into it with a flashlight.

The Good News: Both push rods were fine.

The Bad News: I then pulled the spark plug and lightly pushed the kick starter; no spark and no compression. Then about the 3rd time I pushed down on the kick start lever it all locked up.

I don't want to do anything to further the damage so I am going to remove the engine so I can properly work on it. If it's too bad, I'll pull the engine from my "parts bike" which is also a 163FML.

I'll probably be asking some questions soon!

BARLOW · 01-07-2018, 09:16 AM

sounds like fun ... i would do a few more tests before taking it out ... like putting it on a stand and trying to turn the wheel backward in high gear see if it will move ... get a small wooden rod and put it in the spark plug hole and see if the piston moves ... with no spark it could be as easy as the stater coils came loose, but it sounds like it could be bad ... we also require pics, hehe

TommyD · 01-08-2018, 09:06 AM

BARLOW - It didn't appear that the piston was moving up and down. There was absolutely no compression at all. Strangely, the engine rotated several times before it locked up. Something must have jammed up.

I started the process of pulling the engine: Disconnected the electrical, removed carb, removed exhaust, removed chain, skid plate; basically got everything out of the way to pull the engine. At this point I only have a couple more bolts remaining.

I'm curious as to what might have happen. Once I have it on the bench I'll start pulling the top end apart. I'll be sure to post pics!

As far as not having spark. I think the kill switch was left on. It's been a long time since I've worked on motorcycles

Megadan · 01-08-2018, 01:53 PM

Sounds to me like the valve timing is off and a valve is open during the compression stroke, that would explain the no compression. If said valve was open at the wrong time when the piston came up, it may have also jammed into the valve and locked the motor up. Just speculation, but that is one guess.

**JerryHawk250** · 01-08-2018, 02:07 PM

Being a push rod motor I don't think it jumped timing. If it were a OHC I would say yes. Been there done that. Have had it happen when I had too much slack in the timing chain. It's like jamming on the breaks at WOT when it does jump. It's possible your connecting rod end cap is sitting in the base. The engine will turn free until the connecting rod hits the crank. Open her up. Parts are cheap for these bikes.

Megadan · 01-08-2018, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryHawk250

Being a push rod motor I don't think it jumped timing. If it were a OHC I would say yes. Been there done that. Have had it happen when I had too much slack in the timing chain. It's like jamming on the breaks at WOT when it does jump. It's possible your connecting rod end cap is sitting in the base. The engine will turn free until the connecting rod hits the crank. Open her up. Parts are cheap for these bikes.

My assumption is, somebody took this motor apart to some level trying to diagnose the previous issue and may have slapped the cam and rocker assembly back together incorrectly.

That said, your theory is also very possible. I am also speculating that the item that bent in the motor may have been the connecting rod.

In any case, the right path is to definitely pull the motor apart. That will definitely reveal all.

**JerryHawk250** · 01-08-2018, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Megadan

My assumption is, somebody took this motor apart to some level trying to diagnose the previous issue and may have slapped the cam and rocker assembly back together incorrectly.

That said, your theory is also very possible. I am also speculating that the item that bent in the motor may have been the connecting rod.

In any case, the right path is to definitely pull the motor apart. That will definitely reveal all.

Ahhhh! I must of missed that post. Very possible. We need pictures, Lots of pictures.

You'll have enough help here if you have any questions.

Megadan · 01-08-2018, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerryHawk250

Ahhhh! I must of missed that post. Very possible. We need pictures, Lots of pictures.

You'll have enough help here if you have any questions.

There wasn't a post that stated that directly. Just an assumption. Supposedly a mechanic looked at it and diagnosed a bent push rod. However, the more I think about it the more I doubt this possibility, because no bent pushrod was found. So either it was a lazy mechanic, or a blind one.

TommyD · 01-08-2018, 06:04 PM

Thanks guys - Unfortunately, I didn't finish getting the engine out today as today got away from me. I work late swing shifts but also help my wife (with her job) and special-needs grandson during the day. It might rain tomorrow, but if it's decent out I'll finish pulling it, get it on a bench and start pulling the top-end apart...and take pictures.

Just to recap: The seller said the motorcycle mechanic told him it probably threw a push rod, it had no compression, but the engine turned freely with no noise.

What I found: Upon lifting up the valve cover (couldn't remove it as it hit the frame) it appeared the push rods were in place and moving freely up and down when I pushed the kick starter by hand. I pulled the spark plug and there was absolutely no compression at all. Then after a few rotations - by hand - the engine locked up. It might possibly still be something in the valve area but I can't get the cover off without pulling the engine. This frame has a gusset and thick welds that make it impossible to remove the cover. Makes be wonder if the valves were ever adjusted as that would have been a challenge - but possible, I guess.

At this point it sounds like the mechanic simply ventured a guess rather than actually diagnosing this thing. Supposedly the seller was going to have this mechanic fix it but the mechanic was backed up with work and couldn't get to it.

I am hoping the problem(s) are found in the top-end. If so, I would be fine with purchasing whatever is needed if I can find the right parts. I don't know if the 163FML parts I see on Ebay are compatible with this Jialing engine (JL163FML) or not.

My other option is to see if the LC163FML off my Loncin parts bike is any good. The seller claims it ran great when he got it but has sat in a garage for over a year. Absolute worse case scenario would be to purchase a Lifan engine off E-Bay but I think the ad said they only offered a 14 day warranty. I sent the seller a question regarding the transmission cover and he said they did not come with one. I know the one on my Jialing is different and my Loncin bike doesn't have one.

I'm getting excited to explore this mystery, especially now that title and registration is complete.

TommyD · 01-16-2018, 01:42 PM

Just an update:

I was so excited to finish pulling the engine and start the diagnosis process when.... my whole family came down with the flu!

I'm now at the tail-end of it. Aches and pains, bad cough, exhaustion. Other than that I feel wonderful. Little David, our grandson, is about where my wife is in the process. I was not scheduled to work Monday (MLK Day) but already called out sick for tonight. That's the first time I've called out sick in around 20 years.

I just thought I'd drop by and explain that the "new guy" hasn't flaked out. I am very serious and excited to get this engine diagnosed so I can get this project underway.

In the meantime, I am staying motivated by reading other peoples threads and learning from them.

Stay healthy my friends. Getting sick really sucks!

**JerryHawk250** · 01-16-2018, 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TommyD

Just an update:

I was so excited to finish pulling the engine and start the diagnosis process when.... my whole family came down with the flu!

I'm now at the tail-end of it. Aches and pains, bad cough, exhaustion. Other than that I feel wonderful. Little David, our grandson, is about where my wife is in the process. I was not scheduled to work Monday (MLK Day) but already called out sick for tonight. That's the first time I've called out sick in around 20 years.

I just thought I'd drop by and explain that the "new guy" hasn't flaked out. I am very serious and excited to get this engine diagnosed so I can get this project underway.

In the meantime, I am staying motivated by reading other peoples threads and learning from them.

Stay healthy my friends. Getting sick really sucks!

Hope you get well soon. Can't leave the bike hangin to long as it s sick too.

Megadan · 01-16-2018, 02:42 PM

Hey, it happens. I came down with a long term case of the overtimes, so I can't work on my stuff much either. At least I will have plenty of extra cash to throw around... I might have to pick up another bike.

Hope you feel better soon.

01-06-2018, 04:34 PM	#1
TommyD Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Arizona Posts: 89	Started working on the Jialing 200cc Well, today I finally started working on the Jialing that I was told (by the seller) had probably thrown a push rod. I went to remove the cover but it wouldn't clear the frame so I peeked into it with a flashlight. The Good News: Both push rods were fine. The Bad News: I then pulled the spark plug and lightly pushed the kick starter; no spark and no compression. Then about the 3rd time I pushed down on the kick start lever it all locked up. I don't want to do anything to further the damage so I am going to remove the engine so I can properly work on it. If it's too bad, I'll pull the engine from my "parts bike" which is also a 163FML. I'll probably be asking some questions soon!
	0

01-08-2018, 01:53 PM	#4
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 7,927	Sounds to me like the valve timing is off and a valve is open during the compression stroke, that would explain the no compression. If said valve was open at the wrong time when the piston came up, it may have also jammed into the valve and locked the motor up. Just speculation, but that is one guess. __________________ 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2010 VFR1200F - http://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20708
	0

01-08-2018, 02:07 PM	#5
JerryHawk250 Moderator Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Houma, La. Posts: 11,542	Being a push rod motor I don't think it jumped timing. If it were a OHC I would say yes. Been there done that. Have had it happen when I had too much slack in the timing chain. It's like jamming on the breaks at WOT when it does jump. It's possible your connecting rod end cap is sitting in the base. The engine will turn free until the connecting rod hits the crank. Open her up. Parts are cheap for these bikes. __________________ 2023 Lifan Lycan 250 Chopper 2023 Venom Evader 2022 Lifan KPX250 2020 Kawasaki Vulcan S 2004 Honda ST 1300 2016 Black Hawk 250 (sold) Keihin PE30 carb,125 main,38 slow.Pod filter,ported & decked head 10:1 CR,Direct Ignition Coil,15/40Sprockets,NGK DPR8EIX-9,De-Cat,Dual Oil Cooler,Digital Cluster 2016 Cazador180 XL 2014 Coolster150 JerryHawk250.com My YouTube Channel
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01-16-2018, 02:42 PM	#12
Megadan Join Date: Apr 2017 Location: Omaha, NE Posts: 7,927	Hey, it happens. I came down with a long term case of the overtimes, so I can't work on my stuff much either. At least I will have plenty of extra cash to throw around... I might have to pick up another bike. Hope you feel better soon. __________________ 2018 Hawk 250 - Full Mod list here. http://www.chinariders.net/showpost....62&postcount=1 Hawk Information and Resource guide: http://www.chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20331 2010 VFR1200F - http://chinariders.net/showthread.php?t=20708
	0

01-07-2018, 09:16 AM	#2
BARLOW Join Date: Jan 2016 Location: central illinois Posts: 362	sounds like fun ... i would do a few more tests before taking it out ... like putting it on a stand and trying to turn the wheel backward in high gear see if it will move ... get a small wooden rod and put it in the spark plug hole and see if the piston moves ... with no spark it could be as easy as the stater coils came loose, but it sounds like it could be bad ... we also require pics, hehe
	0

01-08-2018, 09:06 AM	#3
TommyD Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Arizona Posts: 89	BARLOW - It didn't appear that the piston was moving up and down. There was absolutely no compression at all. Strangely, the engine rotated several times before it locked up. Something must have jammed up. I started the process of pulling the engine: Disconnected the electrical, removed carb, removed exhaust, removed chain, skid plate; basically got everything out of the way to pull the engine. At this point I only have a couple more bolts remaining. I'm curious as to what might have happen. Once I have it on the bench I'll start pulling the top end apart. I'll be sure to post pics! As far as not having spark. I think the kill switch was left on. It's been a long time since I've worked on motorcycles
	0

01-08-2018, 06:04 PM	#9
TommyD Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Arizona Posts: 89	Thanks guys - Unfortunately, I didn't finish getting the engine out today as today got away from me. I work late swing shifts but also help my wife (with her job) and special-needs grandson during the day. It might rain tomorrow, but if it's decent out I'll finish pulling it, get it on a bench and start pulling the top-end apart...and take pictures. Just to recap: The seller said the motorcycle mechanic told him it probably threw a push rod, it had no compression, but the engine turned freely with no noise. What I found: Upon lifting up the valve cover (couldn't remove it as it hit the frame) it appeared the push rods were in place and moving freely up and down when I pushed the kick starter by hand. I pulled the spark plug and there was absolutely no compression at all. Then after a few rotations - by hand - the engine locked up. It might possibly still be something in the valve area but I can't get the cover off without pulling the engine. This frame has a gusset and thick welds that make it impossible to remove the cover. Makes be wonder if the valves were ever adjusted as that would have been a challenge - but possible, I guess. At this point it sounds like the mechanic simply ventured a guess rather than actually diagnosing this thing. Supposedly the seller was going to have this mechanic fix it but the mechanic was backed up with work and couldn't get to it. I am hoping the problem(s) are found in the top-end. If so, I would be fine with purchasing whatever is needed if I can find the right parts. I don't know if the 163FML parts I see on Ebay are compatible with this Jialing engine (JL163FML) or not. My other option is to see if the LC163FML off my Loncin parts bike is any good. The seller claims it ran great when he got it but has sat in a garage for over a year. Absolute worse case scenario would be to purchase a Lifan engine off E-Bay but I think the ad said they only offered a 14 day warranty. I sent the seller a question regarding the transmission cover and he said they did not come with one. I know the one on my Jialing is different and my Loncin bike doesn't have one. I'm getting excited to explore this mystery, especially now that title and registration is complete.
	0

01-16-2018, 01:42 PM	#10
TommyD Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Arizona Posts: 89	Just an update: I was so excited to finish pulling the engine and start the diagnosis process when.... my whole family came down with the flu! I'm now at the tail-end of it. Aches and pains, bad cough, exhaustion. Other than that I feel wonderful. Little David, our grandson, is about where my wife is in the process. I was not scheduled to work Monday (MLK Day) but already called out sick for tonight. That's the first time I've called out sick in around 20 years. I just thought I'd drop by and explain that the "new guy" hasn't flaked out. I am very serious and excited to get this engine diagnosed so I can get this project underway. In the meantime, I am staying motivated by reading other peoples threads and learning from them. Stay healthy my friends. Getting sick really sucks!
	2