Odd build - Page 3

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-30-2016, 09:31 PM

Well, I took her for a spin tonight! Ran real good; I just let the sprocket ride wherever it wanted to and didn't notice anything bad that was chain related. That was just for this little test ride. I didn't even bolt the tank or seat down.

Rode over to a buddys house to show him the Chonda was alive! The first 4 gears are tight and low and very similar to the Honda 6 speed that used to live in that space. 5th is a pretty big drop, which I like; sorta like a wide ratio WR transmission. Overall I think it needs a little higher gearing. It pulls much harder than the worn out 200 for sure!!

On my way home I took the scenic route to get a few break-in miles on her. That is when trouble began to brew. The bike has a Voyager dash with a spark plug temperature sensor built in. Here is the dash trend:

Name: Voyager Temperature First Ride.jpg
Views: 530
Size: 27.7 KB

Name: Voyager Temperature First Ride.jpg
Views: 530
Size: 27.7 KB

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-30-2016, 09:32 PM

As you can see it hit 407 F!!

Ambient in my shop was 75F:

Name: Voyager.jpg
Views: 488
Size: 22.5 KB

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-30-2016, 09:34 PM

So I pulled the plug, which was tough to get a good picture of being hot and all:

Name: SparkPlug first ride.jpg
Views: 473
Size: 51.9 KB

It looks like it is running a bit too lean.

Need to buy some bigger jets for the PD27!!

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-30-2016, 09:35 PM

Name: Front Mounts.jpg
Views: 461
Size: 87.6 KB

Name: PD Carby.jpg
Views: 452
Size: 90.5 KB

Name: CF right side.jpg
Views: 419
Size: 87.3 KB

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-30-2016, 09:37 PM

As you can see in the above picture the starter solenoid also needs a mounting bracket made.

Dumped the oil while it was hot so I can get some better stuff in there.

Does anyone know what temperature these motors should run at?? Over 400 seems too high.

Weldangrind · 10-31-2016, 12:45 AM

No idea what temp it should run at; never tried to measure. Perhaps you'd like to try the carb you had on your XR200 motor. I'll bet it's a Keihin. What are the jet sizes in it?

If you feel like splitting the case, I'd be inclined to believe the XR200 six speed will drop into the CB case. You're used to those gears.

Thanks for the install pics!

bogieboy · 10-31-2016, 06:26 AM

as an fyi, my CB200 (163fml pushrod engine) runs right on the 340-365 range when I am riding... and that's pushing the wngine a bit... if I really flog it, I will see 375-400, and given new engine and tight parts, 400 isn't out of the realm of possibility, however I think your temps will come down a good 50 degrees with a fatter main jet...

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-31-2016, 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weldangrind

No idea what temp it should run at; never tried to measure. Perhaps you'd like to try the carb you had on your XR200 motor. I'll bet it's a Keihin. What are the jet sizes in it?

If you feel like splitting the case, I'd be inclined to believe the XR200 six speed will drop into the CB case. You're used to those gears.

Thanks for the install pics!

This is the carb off the 200! Its a factory Honda Keihin PD97 that I bought about 8 months ago because I was tired of dealing with worn out crap. It worked really well on the 200.

The jetting is stock. I believe the main is a 110. Perhaps with the bigger motor it needs a richer main. Especially with the bigger exhaust and large air filter. (Both of which were on the 200) I think the pipe is an old Powroll design.

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-31-2016, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bogieboy

as an fyi, my CB200 (163fml pushrod engine) runs right on the 340-365 range when I am riding... and that's pushing the wngine a bit... if I really flog it, I will see 375-400, and given new engine and tight parts, 400 isn't out of the realm of possibility, however I think your temps will come down a good 50 degrees with a fatter main jet...

Awesome info!!

Those are more like what I would expect.

I tore the carb top off last night and richened the needle position by moving the clip down 2 notches. I'll try it again tonight and see if it runs cooler. It also has fresh Mobil1 V-twin in the case now.

Weldangrind · 10-31-2016, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChondaChondaChonda

This is the carb off the 200! Its a factory Honda Keihin PD97 that I bought about 8 months ago because I was tired of dealing with worn out crap. It worked really well on the 200.

The jetting is stock. I believe the main is a 110. Perhaps with the bigger motor it needs a richer main. Especially with the bigger exhaust and large air filter. (Both of which were on the 200) I think the pipe is an old Powroll design.

Your sig indicates that you also have an early XR200. Can you remove the carb and check the jetting, just for giggles? IIRC, the stock main on an XR200R is closer to 130, but I could be way off. What elevation are you at?

ChondaChondaChonda · 10-31-2016, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weldangrind

Your sig indicates that you also have an early XR200. Can you remove the carb and check the jetting, just for giggles? IIRC, the stock main on an XR200R is closer to 130, but I could be way off. What elevation are you at?

The early XR200 used a PD27 which has very different jetting than the later model PD97 carb due to differences in the design of the air passageways. I presume this was done to meet EPA or CARB requirements at the time. The PD97 I bought from Revzilla so it was brand new and still has the 110 main 38 pilot. This motor may need a 112 main??

I'm just at 4950' or so, but our summer riding was from 7000' to 9500' ft which is why my needle was dropped. I actually bought a 108 and 106 jet in case I needed to swap them out over 9000'. It got a little blubbery and harder to start, but ran good enough to climb the passes so I never used them.

Weldangrind · 10-31-2016, 11:45 PM

You might be really close at 110 at your elevation. Fine tuning, experimentation and plug reading will help you dial it in, but you already knew that.

ChondaChondaChonda · 11-01-2016, 08:41 AM

Last night's ride was much better, but the ambient was also 20 degrees cooler. Temps stayed 360-375 for the most part. I did one "speed run" 5th gear high rpm that triggered my temp alarm at 392. The difference was this time the temperature dropped quickly as I slowed down.

My sprockets are 12/50 which is way too low for this motor. A 13t is on the way and I think it will help. Also going to try a 112 main, especially for cooler weather like this. It was 56F riding around last night; fun getting waved at by all the little trick-or-treaters!

BlackBike · 11-01-2016, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChondaChondaChonda

Last night's ride was much better, but the ambient was also 20 degrees cooler. Temps stayed 360-375 for the most part. I did one "speed run" 5th gear high rpm that triggered my temp alarm at 392. The difference was this time the temperature dropped quickly as I slowed down.

My sprockets are 12/50 which is way too low for this motor. A 13t is on the way and I think it will help. Also going to try a 112 main, especially for cooler weather like this. It was 56F riding around last night; fun getting waved at by all the little trick-or-treaters!

how bout a pic of that bike with your trick or treat outfit.

ChondaChondaChonda · 11-01-2016, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackBike

how bout a pic of that bike with your trick or treat outfit.

Just my usual ATTGAT.

Name: Pumkinhelmet.JPG
Views: 461
Size: 19.3 KB

10-30-2016, 09:31 PM	#31
ChondaChondaChonda Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 547	First Ride!!! Well, I took her for a spin tonight! Ran real good; I just let the sprocket ride wherever it wanted to and didn't notice anything bad that was chain related. That was just for this little test ride. I didn't even bolt the tank or seat down. Rode over to a buddys house to show him the Chonda was alive! The first 4 gears are tight and low and very similar to the Honda 6 speed that used to live in that space. 5th is a pretty big drop, which I like; sorta like a wide ratio WR transmission. Overall I think it needs a little higher gearing. It pulls much harder than the worn out 200 for sure!! On my way home I took the scenic route to get a few break-in miles on her. That is when trouble began to brew. The bike has a Voyager dash with a spark plug temperature sensor built in. Here is the dash trend: __________________ 1993 CR125 powered by Zongshen 223cc OHC 2̶0̶1̶6̶ ̶L̶X̶R̶ ̶2̶5̶0̶ ̶E̶F̶I̶ ̶ Sold 2018 GPX Moto FSE250R 1993 Fantic Key-Roo 250
	0

10-30-2016, 09:32 PM	#32
ChondaChondaChonda Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 547	As you can see it hit 407 F!! Ambient in my shop was 75F: __________________ 1993 CR125 powered by Zongshen 223cc OHC 2̶0̶1̶6̶ ̶L̶X̶R̶ ̶2̶5̶0̶ ̶E̶F̶I̶ ̶ Sold 2018 GPX Moto FSE250R 1993 Fantic Key-Roo 250
	0

10-30-2016, 09:34 PM	#33
ChondaChondaChonda Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 547	So I pulled the plug, which was tough to get a good picture of being hot and all: It looks like it is running a bit too lean. Need to buy some bigger jets for the PD27!! __________________ 1993 CR125 powered by Zongshen 223cc OHC 2̶0̶1̶6̶ ̶L̶X̶R̶ ̶2̶5̶0̶ ̶E̶F̶I̶ ̶ Sold 2018 GPX Moto FSE250R 1993 Fantic Key-Roo 250
	1

10-30-2016, 09:35 PM	#34
ChondaChondaChonda Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 547	Some pictures of the motor installed for the curious. __________________ 1993 CR125 powered by Zongshen 223cc OHC 2̶0̶1̶6̶ ̶L̶X̶R̶ ̶2̶5̶0̶ ̶E̶F̶I̶ ̶ Sold 2018 GPX Moto FSE250R 1993 Fantic Key-Roo 250
	2

10-30-2016, 09:37 PM	#35
ChondaChondaChonda Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 547	As you can see in the above picture the starter solenoid also needs a mounting bracket made. Dumped the oil while it was hot so I can get some better stuff in there. Does anyone know what temperature these motors should run at?? Over 400 seems too high. __________________ 1993 CR125 powered by Zongshen 223cc OHC 2̶0̶1̶6̶ ̶L̶X̶R̶ ̶2̶5̶0̶ ̶E̶F̶I̶ ̶ Sold 2018 GPX Moto FSE250R 1993 Fantic Key-Roo 250
	0

10-31-2016, 12:45 AM	#36
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	No idea what temp it should run at; never tried to measure. Perhaps you'd like to try the carb you had on your XR200 motor. I'll bet it's a Keihin. What are the jet sizes in it? If you feel like splitting the case, I'd be inclined to believe the XR200 six speed will drop into the CB case. You're used to those gears. Thanks for the install pics! __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	0

10-31-2016, 06:26 AM	#37
bogieboy Join Date: May 2013 Location: finger lakes NY Posts: 2,042	as an fyi, my CB200 (163fml pushrod engine) runs right on the 340-365 range when I am riding... and that's pushing the wngine a bit... if I really flog it, I will see 375-400, and given new engine and tight parts, 400 isn't out of the realm of possibility, however I think your temps will come down a good 50 degrees with a fatter main jet...
	0

10-31-2016, 11:45 PM	#42
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	You might be really close at 110 at your elevation. Fine tuning, experimentation and plug reading will help you dial it in, but you already knew that. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	1

11-01-2016, 08:41 AM	#43
ChondaChondaChonda Join Date: Oct 2016 Posts: 547	Last night's ride was much better, but the ambient was also 20 degrees cooler. Temps stayed 360-375 for the most part. I did one "speed run" 5th gear high rpm that triggered my temp alarm at 392. The difference was this time the temperature dropped quickly as I slowed down. My sprockets are 12/50 which is way too low for this motor. A 13t is on the way and I think it will help. Also going to try a 112 main, especially for cooler weather like this. It was 56F riding around last night; fun getting waved at by all the little trick-or-treaters! __________________ 1993 CR125 powered by Zongshen 223cc OHC 2̶0̶1̶6̶ ̶L̶X̶R̶ ̶2̶5̶0̶ ̶E̶F̶I̶ ̶ Sold 2018 GPX Moto FSE250R 1993 Fantic Key-Roo 250
	1