Vader Big Bore Kit

[sirmaxwell]

Originally Posted by Themanoz

Hey guys, I've been using this site as a reference for a while now. Finally decided to join in on the fun! So I have a Vader/Baodiao 125cc grom clone. I have been doing some work on it here and there, mainly power upgrades to keep up with traffic in busy Southern California aka 60 mph comfortably. So far, I have installed the mikuni 26mm carb, 17t front sprocket, and aftermarket exhaust w/ gutted cat. Top speed was 60 mph exactly so far! Now I'm looking for a big bore kit as a next step.

Here are my 2 options that I have found:

http://www.tbparts.com/product/tb-14...nimport-heads/

http://www.tbparts.com/product/tb-14...nimport-heads/


So my question is: what is the wrist pin diameter on these engines? My research hasn't given solid results. The 141cc bore requires a 14mm pin and the 146cc bore requires a 13mm pin. Do you guys think it would be possible to fit a 14mm piston with the 146cc kit? On another site, it says the 146cc kit has a 14mm option (https://tboltusa.com/store/tbparts-r...ines-p-55.html)

On a separate note, would this cam fit in the head?

https://tboltusa.com/store/race-cam-...ds-p-2482.html

I know this is long, just need some input! Thanks guys.

Sorry for so many replies...just so much to think about.

WHat size upgraded carb with what jets should I use for 100% stock Vader 125cc with stock Cali/CARB emissions airbox/exhaust?

What size should the carb and jets be if I make exhaust free flow i.e. at least removing the guts off the stock pipe and running a UNI air filter at 300 feet above sea level in 55-70 degree weather?

Thanks I would reeaaallllyy appreciate an answer so I don't have to guess and cuz I hear the stock carb, like many China carbs, is bad AND faulty!!

Ya know these always crappy stock China carbs really makes me wonder how that really makes emissions better if half the CHina underpowered carbs end up leaking terribly and malfunctioning costing tons of gasoline spill pollution and etra carbon pollution to manufacture a brand new working carb plus the old one takes up room in the rubbish heap!!

[Themanoz]

Originally Posted by sirmaxwell

Sorry for so many replies...just so much to think about.

WHat size upgraded carb with what jets should I use for 100% stock Vader 125cc with stock Cali/CARB emissions airbox/exhaust?

What size should the carb and jets be if I make exhaust free flow i.e. at least removing the guts off the stock pipe and running a UNI air filter at 300 feet above sea level in 55-70 degree weather?

Thanks I would reeaaallllyy appreciate an answer so I don't have to guess and cuz I hear the stock carb, like many China carbs, is bad AND faulty!!

Ya know these always crappy stock China carbs really makes me wonder how that really makes emissions better if half the CHina underpowered carbs end up leaking terribly and malfunctioning costing tons of gasoline spill pollution and etra carbon pollution to manufacture a brand new working carb plus the old one takes up room in the rubbish heap!!

One of the first things I changed on this bike is the carb. The choke sucked and was way too small to get any decent power out of it. This is the one I bought:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It's a replica of the Mikuni vm26, so if you wanna buy the genuine Mikuni go ahead. This carb works good though. Only complaint that the fuel/air screw is a little difficult to reach when its mounted on the engine. The idle screw is fine. You have to remove the EGR system to put this carb on as well as plug a hole in the stock cylinder head from this system. However, if you buy that race head then you wont have to worry about that Also, I don't think California inspects motorcycles? There's no smog test for motorcycles so I'm assuming there's no visual inspection on them either. So I ripped off all my emissions stuff and gutted my cat on the exhaust and welded on an aftermarket muffler haha

[sirmaxwell]

Originally Posted by Themanoz

One of the first things I changed on this bike is the carb. The choke sucked and was way too small to get any decent power out of it. This is the one I bought:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It's a replica of the Mikuni vm26, so if you wanna buy the genuine Mikuni go ahead. This carb works good though. Only complaint that the fuel/air screw is a little difficult to reach when its mounted on the engine. The idle screw is fine. You have to remove the EGR system to put this carb on as well as plug a hole in the stock cylinder head from this system. However, if you buy that race head then you wont have to worry about that Also, I don't think California inspects motorcycles? There's no smog test for motorcycles so I'm assuming there's no visual inspection on them either. So I ripped off all my emissions stuff and gutted my cat on the exhaust and welded on an aftermarket muffler haha

Ohh..I was just wondering what size to go with and just posted on another thread of this forum asking qhat size carb to go with. WHat size is stock carb/jets? and if I only start with changing the carb and MAYBE a UNI filter Maybe removing some guts from the stock exhaust (if it's easy and doesn't involve a hacksaw!) then should I go with the 22mm or 26mm Mikuni/clone? and I know I already asked but also any jet suggestions for whatever carb anyone reccomends is welcome! Thanks

also Sigma6 posts a kit on Ebay for just under $40 I COULD use on stock or replacement carb that includes:
Main Jets
Pilot Jet
Needle Adjusters
Nylon Needle Spacers
Slide Spring Modification
Drill Bits for
Slide Hole Modification (optional)
Idle Mixture Modification
Intake Airbox Modification
Exhaust Modification
Tuning Tech
Bike Specs
Carb Schematic
Carb Synchronizer Tool (how to build for $5)
Step by step instructions with photos for ease of installation.
Installation Support - If you need assistance we are there for you.

I guess the idea is replace the jets with the kit and also drill the jets (if neccesary) with drill bits included--plus you can drill the stock airbox/exhaust with the included drill bits and Im wondering if this is any good or worth it?

Im thinking I would maybe be better off just getting my own drill bits and my own jet kit if I do go the route of the Sigma6 kit mods but the Sigma6 kit does come with instructions and it is all supposedly cutom measured and all to fit the Vader

[wlfpck]

Originally Posted by sirmaxwell

Ohh..I was just wondering what size to go with and just posted on another thread of this forum asking qhat size carb to go with. WHat size is stock carb/jets? and if I only start with changing the carb and MAYBE a UNI filter Maybe removing some guts from the stock exhaust (if it's easy and doesn't involve a hacksaw!) then should I go with the 22mm or 26mm Mikuni/clone? and I know I already asked but also any jet suggestions for whatever carb anyone reccomends is welcome! Thanks

also Sigma6 posts a kit on Ebay for just under $40 I COULD use on stock or replacement carb that includes:
Main Jets
Pilot Jet
Needle Adjusters
Nylon Needle Spacers
Slide Spring Modification
Drill Bits for
Slide Hole Modification (optional)
Idle Mixture Modification
Intake Airbox Modification
Exhaust Modification
Tuning Tech
Bike Specs
Carb Schematic
Carb Synchronizer Tool (how to build for $5)
Step by step instructions with photos for ease of installation.
Installation Support - If you need assistance we are there for you.

I guess the idea is replace the jets with the kit and also drill the jets (if neccesary) with drill bits included--plus you can drill the stock airbox/exhaust with the included drill bits and Im wondering if this is any good or worth it?

Im thinking I would maybe be better off just getting my own drill bits and my own jet kit if I do go the route of the Sigma6 kit mods but the Sigma6 kit does come with instructions and it is all supposedly cutom measured and all to fit the Vader

Would not waste time modifying the OEM/Factory carb. Just get a Mikuni VM22 carb and jet as needed. You can buy Mikuni jets on tons of sites and no need to drill anything.

[sirmaxwell]

Originally Posted by Themanoz

One of the first things I changed on this bike is the carb. The choke sucked and was way too small to get any decent power out of it. This is the one I bought:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1

It's a replica of the Mikuni vm26, so if you wanna buy the genuine Mikuni go ahead. This carb works good though. Only complaint that the fuel/air screw is a little difficult to reach when its mounted on the engine. The idle screw is fine. You have to remove the EGR system to put this carb on as well as plug a hole in the stock cylinder head from this system. However, if you buy that race head then you wont have to worry about that Also, I don't think California inspects motorcycles? There's no smog test for motorcycles so I'm assuming there's no visual inspection on them either. So I ripped off all my emissions stuff and gutted my cat on the exhaust and welded on an aftermarket muffler haha

Nice upgrades! I am thinking of doing a carb upgrade as one of my next mods, although I’m not sure if I should go Mikuni style VM22 or keep the PZ style and go with a “PZ26”— I think those two have the same or similar inner diameter openings from the airbox and to the engine. I also looked up the bolt holes on the engine side of a PZ26 clone carb and I think it has the same bolt spacing as the stock PZ20 or within 1 mm of it, depending on which clone I looked at, which makes me wonder if maybe I can use the aftermarket carb with an engine side 26mm inner diameter with the stock intake boot since the bolt holes appear to line up, just not sure if the inner diameter of the intake boot is a lot smaller or too small to properly match up with the new carb or not —-so can I use the stock intake boot that goes between the carb and engine with either the VM22 Mikuni clone or with the PZ26 clone? OR Do I have to get an intake boot also? And I think the airbox side of the aftermarket carbs will be at least 6mm larger than stock SO Do I also need a new air filter? OR Can I use a coupler to fit the new carb to the airbox?— OR am I better off just getting a new carb with a new intake boot and a new air filter?

also the VM22 Mikuni Clone carbs also have the 47mm to 48mm bolt hole spacing to attach to the engine intake boot. Has anyone tried to install the VM22 with the stock intake boot?--OR is this a bad idea?

I know that I will have to get rid of at least part of the emissions when installing a new carb, including there is something, some air hose that attached into the side of the engine intake boot I believe, but I'm assuming if I reuse the stock intake boot I COULD just cap off the nipple on the intake boot since I won't be re-attaching the air line to it

[RedCrowRides]

The block off plate needed isn't hard to make at all , i used a piece of 1/8" thick aluminum scrap ,traced design on , cut it out with a raggedy jigsaw then cleaned up the outside with a file ,drilled the two holes in it and bingo It is not under any kind of hi pressure so it doesnt have to be super strong or precise ,you could use most anything that wont melt to make it out of .Kronik Racing ,often mentioned on this Forum "might" actually have made ones they will sell but really it's so easy to make

I'm not sure there is much demand ,but you could check with them.

[sirmaxwell]

Originally Posted by RedCrowRides

The block off plate needed isn't hard to make at all , i used a piece of 1/8" thick aluminum scrap ,traced design on , cut it out with a raggedy jigsaw then cleaned up the outside with a file ,drilled the two holes in it and bingo It is not under any kind of hi pressure so it doesnt have to be super strong or precise ,you could use most anything that wont melt to make it out of .Kronik Racing ,often mentioned on this Forum "might" actually have made ones they will sell but really it's so easy to make

I'm not sure there is much demand ,but you could check with them.

For other bikes to block off differt EGR systems I have seen people use whater flange that came with the bike and bolted onto the hole originally then they cut that (if needed) so it is basically a flat plate with the bolt holes to bolt on plus a hole in the middle for where the EGR gasses went thru. THEN they took that and placed it on a piece of scrap wood or whatever and filled in the EGR hole with JB Weld--Then Voila they have a block off plate that definitly alrady has the proper bolt hole pattern and only costed 'em the price of JB Weld--a couple $$ and I have heard it works well from the Youtube community. I am not sure what comes stock on the Vader for an EGR type system but I am going to find out soon and TRY the JB Weld method if I can--otherwise you are correct Mr. RedCrowRides that it seems pretty easy to go make your own block off plate from a piece of steel/aluminum of approximately the right size or a bracket from the hardware store and drill your own bolt holes and clean it up and done!

[sirmaxwell]

Originally Posted by Themanoz

Hey guys, I've been using this site as a reference for a while now. Finally decided to join in on the fun! So I have a Vader/Baodiao 125cc grom clone. I have been doing some work on it here and there, mainly power upgrades to keep up with traffic in busy Southern California aka 60 mph comfortably. So far, I have installed the mikuni 26mm carb, 17t front sprocket, and aftermarket exhaust w/ gutted cat. Top speed was 60 mph exactly so far! Now I'm looking for a big bore kit as a next step.

You should put on see thru engine kits like this timing chain/head side cover: http://www.msx125accessories.com/hon...ead-side-cover