SSR189 Wiring Diagram

zero_dgz · 01-27-2020, 10:49 AM

Hey, does anybody have a line on an actual accurate wiring diagram for the SSR189 dirt bike(s)? I found this flabbergastingly useless thing on SSR's web site, which is all I could turn up:

http://www.ssrmotorsports.com/store/...ng_Diagram.jpg

In addition to almost none of the wire colors indicated matching what's on this bike, it's not actually a wiring diagram. It just shows the plugs, then some magic happens, then some other plugs come out the other side of the harness. Not helpful.

A buddy of mine just bought one of these used and it is a wreck. I ain't no stranger to bikes in general, so got everything working... except the electric start. I have continuity at the plug for the starter button so I know the button works. Main fuse under the seat is not blown. The battery is good, and if I short the terminals together on the starter relay the starter motor cranks, ditto if I provide 12v to the coil plug on the relay so the relay is good. However, I get no voltage whatsoever going to the starter button, regardless of the position of the key in the cylinder. The key literally does nothing. None of the wiring looks like it's been messed with and I cannot find any evidence that the bike has been hotwired, but you can kick start the bike and it will run regardless of the position (or presence) of the key! Off, on, key not inserted at all, it doesn't matter.

Without a diagram I can't figure out where everything is supposed to be getting voltage from without ripping the entire harness off the bike -- which I'm really hoping not to do!

pete · 01-28-2020, 01:45 AM

the starter button will have AC voltage going to it from the rectifier..
The button is to small to carry DC voltage from the battrey...
it will burn out.. "don't as how I know this"
There will also be a diode in the system to stop the AC and DC voltage
coming in contact with each other...

...

zero_dgz · 01-30-2020, 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pete

the starter button will have AC voltage going to it from the rectifier..

Uh. Wut? That would only work if the engine were already running.

Not to be rude, but none of what you just said makes any sense. I'm not sure we're talking about the same question. Are you assuming a kick start only bike? This bike has an electric start, with a starter motor, in addition to the kick start.

My question was to attempt to determine what the circuit path is for the starting system, since the useless diagram I got from SSR does not match what's physically on the bike and is also incomplete. I was trying to determine what other roadblocks might be in the way: Clutch switch? Kickstand switch? Neutral switch? Which wires on the lock cylinder go where? I have no idea, since I am not familiar with this particular bike.

pete · 02-01-2020, 01:27 AM

Ok....

And that's what I thought once to....

.

zero_dgz · 02-01-2020, 01:27 PM

Dude. Are you trying to be some kind of troll?

https://www.quora.com/How-bike-starter-works

There is no AC current anywhere in that system. The button does not have to take the current of the starter motor because that it what the relay is for. The button will only pass the current required by the coil in the relay. That's how electricity works.

All I'm asking for is if anyone has the wiring diagram for this bike in particular. If you don't know the answer and don't have anything factual to add, you don't need to buff up your post count by making up ridiculous buffoonery.

Weldangrind · 02-01-2020, 02:35 PM

Easy, fellas.

Weldangrind · 02-01-2020, 02:40 PM

To your point about kickstarting, I had a bike that behaved in a similar fashion. Turned out that the harness to the CDI had only one ground wire on it, where two would have solved the issue. There are two ground points at the CDI and sometimes one is used, sometimes the other and sometimes both. If the kill switch is not connected to the ground (because the connector lacks a wire), the symptoms you reported will occur.

Weldangrind · 02-01-2020, 02:46 PM

Regarding the electric start, I suspect the solution is also in the CDI connector. Please tell us how many green wires are present at the CDI connector.

While on the electric start topic, the start button is normally interrupted by either the front or back brake (or both). The bike might also have a kickstand switch that has failed (I promptly ditch those). Any of those switches might be failing to complete the starter circuit. I don't care to have brake switches interrupt the starter, so I dedicate the switches to the brake light.

zero_dgz · 02-01-2020, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Weldangrind

If the kill switch is not connected to the ground (because the connector lacks a wire), the symptoms you reported will occur.

Interesting, that's something I'm going to have to look for. The kill switch does work. The key, however, does not. The cylinder should also be connected to pin 5 (top right) of the CDI, right? Or 6, I suppose, the one below it.

I will do some more digging in the wiring the next time I am in the garage. I was chasing the kick stand switch hypothesis, too. The bike used to have a kick stand, but it was ripped off by the previous owner. I did not find any evidence of wiring for a kick stand switch nor anyplace it would be mounted (the bracket for the stand was still there, but the stand itself is gone). But it might be ripped off somewhere up under the seat where I can't see it.

The bike does have a clutch switch. I get continuity where it plugs in under the handlebars if it is closed. However, the status of the clutch switch makes no difference to the starter working or not.

humanbeing · 02-02-2020, 03:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zero_dgz

... almost none of the wire colors indicated matching ...

Most chonda uses this http://www.chinariders.net/showthrea...783#post229783 code...
What's in there? Yammie, Suzi or some unrecognizable color coding...

Weldangrind · 02-02-2020, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zero_dgz

The cylinder should also be connected to pin 5 (top right) of the CDI, right? Or 6, I suppose, the one below it.

Please explain what you mean by cylinder connected to pin 5. I think I understand, but I don't want to assume.

zero_dgz · 02-02-2020, 05:15 PM

The ignition cylinder. But setting that aside for now...

I pulled the tank and all off to access the CDI just now. It does indeed have six wires going to it. Top left is blue/white, top center is black/white, top right is black, bottom right and bottom center are both green, and bottom right is red.

I have verified that all of the green wires are a common ground (at least all of them I can get to with my multimeter). I have verified that the solid red is 12 volts from the battery.

I have also been able to verify that there is 12 volts going to the red wire on the plug for the ignition cylinder.

In other possibly unrelated news, I have verified continuity between the WHITE wire going to the ignition relay as well as the yellow/red wire, which both go up to the front of the harness. One of them appears to go to the clutch switch and the other goes to the starter button. (The plugs are inerchangeable.) However, neither of the other pins on either the starter button or the clutch switch ever have any voltage on them, regardless of the position of the key in the cylinder. I appear to be missing an element somewhere that provides power to this circuit. (I presume it is always energized and is grounded through the relay when all the various switches are closed, including the ignition cylinder.)

@humanbeing: Just from memory, some of the wires match the colors in list you linked in your other post, and have the same function. I'm going to print out your list to take out there and see if they all match. If so, that might lead me in the right direction (at least of what wire does what). Thank you for that!

More news as it develops. The urge to just bypass all of this BS and wire the positive on the starter switch straight to the battery is growing every day I think about this, but I'd really like the key to work (insofar as disabling the starter, anyway).

zero_dgz · 02-02-2020, 10:25 PM

Okay, progress. I have successfully made the stater motor crank by pressing the button on the handlebars for the first time!

Now that I vaguely know what I'm looking at, I traced the entire circuit and I found three (3) faults in the system. Three! The previous owners really did a number on this thing.

There was no kickstand switch. Cross that one off the list.

I found a break in the wire going between the relay and its plug, the positive wire (yellow with red stripe).

I also determined the relay was bad. Despite going "click" when getting voltage, it did not actually provide continuity. I bought a random stater solenoid that's small enough to go under the seat (I hope) at the auto parts store and now that section is functioning.

Now: The ignition cylinder is also bad! It has five wires: Green and black/white on one plug and brown, yellow, and red on the other. Green and black/white I was able to determine go to the CDI from the wire color list that humanbeing provided, so thanks again for that. I presume this is what grounds out the CDI and kills the engine when the key is turned to the off position. There were two plugs on the harness that this could have gone to. The other has a green ground wire and a brown wire. The ignition cylinder was plugged into the wrong one. (Hence why the bike would run regardless of the key position, I presume. I guess I know how to hotwire one of these now, if that skill ever becomes useful in the zombie apocalypse or something.)

But.

No continuity is made between the red wire (positive from battery) and the yellow wire (positive from the cylinder with the key in "run") regardless of the key position. If I jumper these two contacts together at the plug on the harness -- magic! The starting system works.

I assume the ignition cylinders for most of these Chinese bikes are the same so I will source a new cylinder on Amazon. Tomorrow I will take the exiting one apart (it looks like it's just held together with some tabs) and see if I can make it work first.

Weldangrind · 02-04-2020, 11:45 AM

Excellent detective work!

The ignition switches are not all the same, which has bit me in the past. I had a failed switch, so I popped another in its place and then had similar symptoms to yours. It turned out that even though the new switch had the same wire colours and the same pinout at the connector, they were soldered to incorrect terminals on the switch contacts.

Upon rearranging the wires in the connector, it fired right up. The bottom line is that you need to determine which two wires have continuity when switched on; those need to connect the red to the yellow (in your case). The other two wires connect when the key is off.

Just for entertainment, unfold the clamp and pull the bottom of the ignition switch apart. See if one of the wires has broken at the solder joint.

zero_dgz · 02-04-2020, 05:45 PM

We are ready to rock and roll.

I got the ignition cylinder out, and checked all of the solder points on the bottom. Everything looked good, but no continuity between red/yellow even at the solder points. All five wires were good. Insulation intact and continuity between the corresponding solder blob and the pin in the connector(s). I tried to pull the barrel out by pressing in the tabs, but it was so embrittled that the casing started to crack before I could get it apart. I gave up on that strategy.

I reached for my trusty can of contact cleaner... and discovered that while it was still half full, it had no propellant in it. Really?

So I figured, what the hell, and I cut the top of the contact cleaner can off and threw the whole damn lock cylinder in it for an hour. After that I spun the key around to all the different positions a bunch of times, blew it dry with the air compressor, and re-lubed it with graphite. Guess what? Now we have proper continuity on all five contacts. I might still order a cylinder for when this one inevitably fails.

But for now we are in business. Proper operation is restored to both the lock cylinder and the electric start.

What a pain in the balls.

01-27-2020, 10:49 AM	#1
zero_dgz Join Date: Jan 2020 Posts: 253	SSR189 Wiring Diagram Hey, does anybody have a line on an actual accurate wiring diagram for the SSR189 dirt bike(s)? I found this flabbergastingly useless thing on SSR's web site, which is all I could turn up: http://www.ssrmotorsports.com/store/...ng_Diagram.jpg In addition to almost none of the wire colors indicated matching what's on this bike, it's not actually a wiring diagram. It just shows the plugs, then some magic happens, then some other plugs come out the other side of the harness. Not helpful. A buddy of mine just bought one of these used and it is a wreck. I ain't no stranger to bikes in general, so got everything working... except the electric start. I have continuity at the plug for the starter button so I know the button works. Main fuse under the seat is not blown. The battery is good, and if I short the terminals together on the starter relay the starter motor cranks, ditto if I provide 12v to the coil plug on the relay so the relay is good. However, I get no voltage whatsoever going to the starter button, regardless of the position of the key in the cylinder. The key literally does nothing. None of the wiring looks like it's been messed with and I cannot find any evidence that the bike has been hotwired, but you can kick start the bike and it will run regardless of the position (or presence) of the key! Off, on, key not inserted at all, it doesn't matter. Without a diagram I can't figure out where everything is supposed to be getting voltage from without ripping the entire harness off the bike -- which I'm really hoping not to do!
	0

01-28-2020, 01:45 AM	#2
pete Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: ChCh , NZ Posts: 2,261	the starter button will have AC voltage going to it from the rectifier.. The button is to small to carry DC voltage from the battrey... it will burn out.. "don't as how I know this" There will also be a diode in the system to stop the AC and DC voltage coming in contact with each other... ... __________________ 09 XT660R ... 06 TTR250 ... 80 Montesa H6 125 Enduro... 77 Montesa Cota 348 MRR "Malcom Rathnell Replica"... Current resto projects.. 81 Honda CT110... 80 Kawasaki KL250A1... 11 Husaburg TE125 enduro... "sold" along with another 31... Lifan 125 Pitbike.. "stolen" ... KIWI BIKER FORUM...... http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/content.php All the best offroad rides in NZ... http://www.remotemoto.com/ E-mail... xtpete1@gmail.com
	0

02-01-2020, 01:27 AM	#4
pete Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: ChCh , NZ Posts: 2,261	Ok.... And that's what I thought once to.... . __________________ 09 XT660R ... 06 TTR250 ... 80 Montesa H6 125 Enduro... 77 Montesa Cota 348 MRR "Malcom Rathnell Replica"... Current resto projects.. 81 Honda CT110... 80 Kawasaki KL250A1... 11 Husaburg TE125 enduro... "sold" along with another 31... Lifan 125 Pitbike.. "stolen" ... KIWI BIKER FORUM...... http://www.kiwibiker.co.nz/forums/content.php All the best offroad rides in NZ... http://www.remotemoto.com/ E-mail... xtpete1@gmail.com
	0

02-01-2020, 02:35 PM	#6
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	Easy, fellas. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	0

02-01-2020, 02:40 PM	#7
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	To your point about kickstarting, I had a bike that behaved in a similar fashion. Turned out that the harness to the CDI had only one ground wire on it, where two would have solved the issue. There are two ground points at the CDI and sometimes one is used, sometimes the other and sometimes both. If the kill switch is not connected to the ground (because the connector lacks a wire), the symptoms you reported will occur. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	0

02-01-2020, 01:27 PM	#5
zero_dgz Join Date: Jan 2020 Posts: 253	Dude. Are you trying to be some kind of troll? https://www.quora.com/How-bike-starter-works There is no AC current anywhere in that system. The button does not have to take the current of the starter motor because that it what the relay is for. The button will only pass the current required by the coil in the relay. That's how electricity works. All I'm asking for is if anyone has the wiring diagram for this bike in particular. If you don't know the answer and don't have anything factual to add, you don't need to buff up your post count by making up ridiculous buffoonery.
	0

02-01-2020, 02:46 PM	#8
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	Regarding the electric start, I suspect the solution is also in the CDI connector. Please tell us how many green wires are present at the CDI connector. While on the electric start topic, the start button is normally interrupted by either the front or back brake (or both). The bike might also have a kickstand switch that has failed (I promptly ditch those). Any of those switches might be failing to complete the starter circuit. I don't care to have brake switches interrupt the starter, so I dedicate the switches to the brake light. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	0

02-02-2020, 05:15 PM	#12
zero_dgz Join Date: Jan 2020 Posts: 253	The ignition cylinder. But setting that aside for now... I pulled the tank and all off to access the CDI just now. It does indeed have six wires going to it. Top left is blue/white, top center is black/white, top right is black, bottom right and bottom center are both green, and bottom right is red. I have verified that all of the green wires are a common ground (at least all of them I can get to with my multimeter). I have verified that the solid red is 12 volts from the battery. I have also been able to verify that there is 12 volts going to the red wire on the plug for the ignition cylinder. In other possibly unrelated news, I have verified continuity between the WHITE wire going to the ignition relay as well as the yellow/red wire, which both go up to the front of the harness. One of them appears to go to the clutch switch and the other goes to the starter button. (The plugs are inerchangeable.) However, neither of the other pins on either the starter button or the clutch switch ever have any voltage on them, regardless of the position of the key in the cylinder. I appear to be missing an element somewhere that provides power to this circuit. (I presume it is always energized and is grounded through the relay when all the various switches are closed, including the ignition cylinder.) @humanbeing: Just from memory, some of the wires match the colors in list you linked in your other post, and have the same function. I'm going to print out your list to take out there and see if they all match. If so, that might lead me in the right direction (at least of what wire does what). Thank you for that! More news as it develops. The urge to just bypass all of this BS and wire the positive on the starter switch straight to the battery is growing every day I think about this, but I'd really like the key to work (insofar as disabling the starter, anyway).
	0

02-02-2020, 10:25 PM	#13
zero_dgz Join Date: Jan 2020 Posts: 253	Okay, progress. I have successfully made the stater motor crank by pressing the button on the handlebars for the first time! Now that I vaguely know what I'm looking at, I traced the entire circuit and I found three (3) faults in the system. Three! The previous owners really did a number on this thing. There was no kickstand switch. Cross that one off the list. I found a break in the wire going between the relay and its plug, the positive wire (yellow with red stripe). I also determined the relay was bad. Despite going "click" when getting voltage, it did not actually provide continuity. I bought a random stater solenoid that's small enough to go under the seat (I hope) at the auto parts store and now that section is functioning. Now: The ignition cylinder is also bad! It has five wires: Green and black/white on one plug and brown, yellow, and red on the other. Green and black/white I was able to determine go to the CDI from the wire color list that humanbeing provided, so thanks again for that. I presume this is what grounds out the CDI and kills the engine when the key is turned to the off position. There were two plugs on the harness that this could have gone to. The other has a green ground wire and a brown wire. The ignition cylinder was plugged into the wrong one. (Hence why the bike would run regardless of the key position, I presume. I guess I know how to hotwire one of these now, if that skill ever becomes useful in the zombie apocalypse or something.) But. No continuity is made between the red wire (positive from battery) and the yellow wire (positive from the cylinder with the key in "run") regardless of the key position. If I jumper these two contacts together at the plug on the harness -- magic! The starting system works. I assume the ignition cylinders for most of these Chinese bikes are the same so I will source a new cylinder on Amazon. Tomorrow I will take the exiting one apart (it looks like it's just held together with some tabs) and see if I can make it work first.
	0

02-04-2020, 11:45 AM	#14
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	Excellent detective work! The ignition switches are not all the same, which has bit me in the past. I had a failed switch, so I popped another in its place and then had similar symptoms to yours. It turned out that even though the new switch had the same wire colours and the same pinout at the connector, they were soldered to incorrect terminals on the switch contacts. Upon rearranging the wires in the connector, it fired right up. The bottom line is that you need to determine which two wires have continuity when switched on; those need to connect the red to the yellow (in your case). The other two wires connect when the key is off. Just for entertainment, unfold the clamp and pull the bottom of the ignition switch apart. See if one of the wires has broken at the solder joint. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	1

02-04-2020, 05:45 PM	#15
zero_dgz Join Date: Jan 2020 Posts: 253	We are ready to rock and roll. I got the ignition cylinder out, and checked all of the solder points on the bottom. Everything looked good, but no continuity between red/yellow even at the solder points. All five wires were good. Insulation intact and continuity between the corresponding solder blob and the pin in the connector(s). I tried to pull the barrel out by pressing in the tabs, but it was so embrittled that the casing started to crack before I could get it apart. I gave up on that strategy. I reached for my trusty can of contact cleaner... and discovered that while it was still half full, it had no propellant in it. Really? So I figured, what the hell, and I cut the top of the contact cleaner can off and threw the whole damn lock cylinder in it for an hour. After that I spun the key around to all the different positions a bunch of times, blew it dry with the air compressor, and re-lubed it with graphite. Guess what? Now we have proper continuity on all five contacts. I might still order a cylinder for when this one inevitably fails. But for now we are in business. Proper operation is restored to both the lock cylinder and the electric start. What a pain in the balls.
	2