Tao Tao 150 died after only one hour...

sarcopenia · 07-04-2018, 01:23 AM

Greetings All,

So, I decided to pick up a Tao Tao 150 (or ATA-150D, I think it is called) quad. My 11 y/o daughter is enthralled with the used Polaris 500 we bought, but I wanted something smaller and easier to manage. The idea is she would just use it for tooling around on our acreage (it is quite flat ... there are some areas of tall grass though) and get used to the activity and gain confidence.

I made sure to fill the fuel tank with the highest octane gasoline available at the pumps (I have heard about carburetor issues that may be partially prevented by feeding it premium gas).

We had it out for its first ride (trying to do the 3 hour break-in, and then change out for new oil). She got stuck once or twice in the grass and uneven ground. I was able to gently rock it out, or do a three point turn style extrication.

Later on, she said "the quad doesn't work." I freed it again, and then started it up. It drove for about 10 seconds, and then the engine crapped out. I started it up again, and it again lasted for only a very short time before stalling. At this point, I could not restart the motor. When I flick my thumb on the starter switch to the left, it makes the normal starter noises. But nothing happens when I try to feather the throttle on the right side ... no engine sputtering or idle is heard.

About that time, we started to get a cloudburst, and I had to get home (we do not live on the acreage ... it is raw / remote land). I had to put the machine in neutral and let my daughter steer to a suitable location, and then I had to tarp it and head out. This all happened about a week ago.

People did warn me about buying a "non-North American" ATV, and I get that there may be some concerns still. But for a brand new quad to suddenly die after about an hour seems a bit much to me.

***

Does anybody have any advice for me? I'm just learning about small engines. I'm a reasonably quick study, but not really much of a "gear head."

Thanks for any tips / advice.

Douglass · 07-04-2018, 01:50 AM

It seems silly to ask, but did you verify it did not run out of gas?
Did the choke get stuck, or switched on?
Did the fuel valve get shut off?

If these are all good, and if it were me I would start checking wire connections, verify you have spark, make sure fuel is flowing into the carb as a starting point.

Also make sure the kill switch is in the run position. The ATV will crank even if the kill switch is in the off position, it just won't fire up.

Al · 07-04-2018, 07:45 AM

Tall grass may have ripping a wire connection. They are crappy connections.

sarcopenia · 07-04-2018, 12:26 PM

Thanks for those replies.

I actually did not verify the gas level, but I did fill up the whole tank (4.2 L) before going out, and I think these quads are good for like 80 MPG, so I would be shocked if we used all of the fuel. Still, worth checking.

I am unaware of an actual choke on/off valve on that model of quad. There is an "adjustment screw" that is supposed to affect the idle rate, but I don't know about an actual choke valve other than that. I will check the fuel valve again, just in case.

I will also look for loose connections wrt the kill switch...

Thanks again. I'll try and post back if I figure out what the problem was!

ben2go · 07-04-2018, 01:05 PM

I have heard of people filling the tank on a new ATV only to later have problems with running. Some of them found their carbs to be filled with gunk. I think it's either a tank rust inhibitor or the tanks were full of gunk from being made. If you have a fuel filter, check it, if not install one, and make sure it's rated for gravity flow. Any small engine shop should have one for a few dollars.

tortoise · 07-04-2018, 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sarcopenia

could not restart the motor

No mention of verifying spark or fuel flow?

There are NUMEROUS GY6 engine YouTube troubleshooting videos!

sarcopenia · 07-04-2018, 03:23 PM

That part about "gunk in the fuel tank" and the carburetor is a bit unsettling. I hope that isn't the problem. Not sure I am capable of installing after market parts onto this. I guess I could try to take the carburetor apart and clean it or something though.

Hmm.

Well, I'm going tomorrow to check it out. If not, I'll have to get it to the dealer somehow. It's going to be a b!t$h to load onto my truck just using brute force though....

ben2go · 07-04-2018, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sarcopenia

That part about "gunk in the fuel tank" and the carburetor is a bit unsettling. I hope that isn't the problem. Not sure I am capable of installing after market parts onto this. I guess I could try to take the carburetor apart and clean it or something though.

Hmm.

Well, I'm going tomorrow to check it out. If not, I'll have to get it to the dealer somehow. It's going to be a b!t$h to load onto my truck just using brute force though....

Gunked up carb would be a worse case scenario. Check for spark and fuel flow at the carb. Also check the oil just in case it's low. Break ins can use some oil until the rings seat.

Paul2 · 07-05-2018, 07:07 AM

Hate to say this, I purchased 2 150bulls, same issue with one of them, then I did the new plug n oil n played with the carb per dealers suggestions,
result?: The dealer sent me out a new carb and in 2 days, $15 he paid for, I immediately drained the fuel as I had ETHANOL 93 high test mobil gas, and switched to ethanol free from an airbase near me, then installed carb, wasn't too bad, and magically NEVER had another issue.
Again, mine did the same thing! so either clean the carb (by drilling out the screws on the bowl, and blah blah blah) OR call them and get a new one, install and change ALL the fuel and never go back to an ethanol mix.
In the northeast for some reason the fuel and liberals are brutal and immediately ruin everything.
Hope it works out,, I felt your pain.

tortoise · 07-05-2018, 09:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul2

drilling out the screws on the bowl

Weldangrind · 07-05-2018, 11:28 AM

All other troubleshooting aside, it's a good idea to check and adjust the valves. The valves are almost never set properly from the factory and an engine will not run if a valve is too tight. It is a simple procedure that is accomplished with basic hand tools and a feeler gauge. Do a YouTube search on GY6 valve adjustment and give it a try. Ensure that the engine is stone cold; allow it to sit overnight before beginning the procedure.

These are not high compression engines, so high octane fuel will only make starting more difficult. Save your money and use regular grade fuel.

sarcopenia · 07-05-2018, 11:39 PM

Hi again, everybody.

Call it luck (or divine intervention), but when I went out to check on the quad, it roared to life like it was just waiting for me.

Gas tank was 3/4 full. Oil level was full (I'll probably change it next time I go out, since it is still the "break-in oil" from the dealer). I inspected the undercarriage. Everything was clean and dry, no grass debris or mud obstructing anything. I could see no obvious loose connections or anything.

I was able to maneuver it into the "garage" am constructing for it (a covered platform in the woods using 4 trees as the pillars) without difficulty.

I am now torn between "just being happy that it works" vs. wondering about intermittent causes of the previous symptoms?

Also, I am a bit confused with respect to the grade of gasoline, as per comments above. Notwithstanding the fact that everybody on these forums seems to know more than I do, I was under the impression that high test gas is usually not "bad" (other than wasted money). This quad is in a remote location. It will be used only about once per month. Because of this, I was worried about phase separation and varnishing. I was hoping high test gas would be better.

I am also in an extreme climate. Summer gets up to 30 deg C (86 deg F for you Americans), and winter gets down to -40 deg C (-40 deg F).

Thanks again everybody. I still have lot to learn, and I intend to have fun while doing it!

Hellkitty · 07-06-2018, 12:41 AM

Did you buy it from a dealer that put in the break in oil or is it the oil the atv was shipped with? I wouldn't even run it with the shipping oil. I would change it immediately.

Douglass · 07-06-2018, 10:08 AM

x2 - change the oil before you run it again. If you have an owners manual, you can check to see what grade of oil to use with the current temp. I run the 15w40 rotella t4 in all my units. You should be fine running 10w40 to 15w40 oil in your 65-95 deg. F months.

I'll check a couple of manuals when I get home to see if it lists grade recommendations based on temp.

On all five of my bikes it says to use 91-93 octane on the emissions label, and I think it also lists it in the manual. The highest grade of fuel I can get from the pump is 91. I have been using 91 in all of them, and they all run good and strong.

Weldangrind · 07-06-2018, 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Douglass

x2 - change the oil before you run it again. If you have an owners manual, you can check to see what grade of oil to use with the current temp. I run the 15w40 rotella t4 in all my units. You should be fine running 10w40 to 15w40 oil in your 65-95 deg. F months.

I'll check a couple of manuals when I get home to see if it lists grade recommendations based on temp.

On all five of my bikes it says to use 91-93 octane on the emissions label, and I think it also lists it in the manual. The highest grade of fuel I can get from the pump is 91. I have been using 91 in all of them, and they all run good and strong.

Douglass, those are all excellent points. Humanbeing taught me that we use R+M/2 as an octane rating system in North America, which is "4 to 6 octane numbers lower than elsewhere in the world for the same fuel", according to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Octane_rating
The data that is produced for China bikes does not directly translate to North American fuel, so we're fine around the mid-80's for octane levels.

I'm in SW British Columbia, and I run Rotella 15W40 all year (which is normally between 32F and 100F or 0C and 35C). Granted, it doesn't get very cold where I live, but I do take my machines into the mountains on occasion. If I were to ride in much colder weather, I'd look for 10W40 or even 5W40.

Indeed, don't run the machine on the shipping oil; it's only purpose is to prevent corrosion.

07-04-2018, 01:23 AM	#1
sarcopenia Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 4	Tao Tao 150 died after only one hour... Greetings All, So, I decided to pick up a Tao Tao 150 (or ATA-150D, I think it is called) quad. My 11 y/o daughter is enthralled with the used Polaris 500 we bought, but I wanted something smaller and easier to manage. The idea is she would just use it for tooling around on our acreage (it is quite flat ... there are some areas of tall grass though) and get used to the activity and gain confidence. I made sure to fill the fuel tank with the highest octane gasoline available at the pumps (I have heard about carburetor issues that may be partially prevented by feeding it premium gas). We had it out for its first ride (trying to do the 3 hour break-in, and then change out for new oil). She got stuck once or twice in the grass and uneven ground. I was able to gently rock it out, or do a three point turn style extrication. Later on, she said "the quad doesn't work." I freed it again, and then started it up. It drove for about 10 seconds, and then the engine crapped out. I started it up again, and it again lasted for only a very short time before stalling. At this point, I could not restart the motor. When I flick my thumb on the starter switch to the left, it makes the normal starter noises. But nothing happens when I try to feather the throttle on the right side ... no engine sputtering or idle is heard. About that time, we started to get a cloudburst, and I had to get home (we do not live on the acreage ... it is raw / remote land). I had to put the machine in neutral and let my daughter steer to a suitable location, and then I had to tarp it and head out. This all happened about a week ago. People did warn me about buying a "non-North American" ATV, and I get that there may be some concerns still. But for a brand new quad to suddenly die after about an hour seems a bit much to me. *** Does anybody have any advice for me? I'm just learning about small engines. I'm a reasonably quick study, but not really much of a "gear head." Thanks for any tips / advice.
	0

07-05-2018, 11:28 AM	#11
Weldangrind Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Sardis, BC, Canada Posts: 25,977	All other troubleshooting aside, it's a good idea to check and adjust the valves. The valves are almost never set properly from the factory and an engine will not run if a valve is too tight. It is a simple procedure that is accomplished with basic hand tools and a feeler gauge. Do a YouTube search on GY6 valve adjustment and give it a try. Ensure that the engine is stone cold; allow it to sit overnight before beginning the procedure. These are not high compression engines, so high octane fuel will only make starting more difficult. Save your money and use regular grade fuel. __________________ Weldangrind "I figure I'm well-prepared for coping with a bike that comes from the factory with unresolved issues and that rewards the self-reliant owner." - Buccaneer
	1

07-05-2018, 11:39 PM	#12
sarcopenia Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 4	It's ALIVE Hi again, everybody. Call it luck (or divine intervention), but when I went out to check on the quad, it roared to life like it was just waiting for me. Gas tank was 3/4 full. Oil level was full (I'll probably change it next time I go out, since it is still the "break-in oil" from the dealer). I inspected the undercarriage. Everything was clean and dry, no grass debris or mud obstructing anything. I could see no obvious loose connections or anything. I was able to maneuver it into the "garage" am constructing for it (a covered platform in the woods using 4 trees as the pillars) without difficulty. I am now torn between "just being happy that it works" vs. wondering about intermittent causes of the previous symptoms? Also, I am a bit confused with respect to the grade of gasoline, as per comments above. Notwithstanding the fact that everybody on these forums seems to know more than I do, I was under the impression that high test gas is usually not "bad" (other than wasted money). This quad is in a remote location. It will be used only about once per month. Because of this, I was worried about phase separation and varnishing. I was hoping high test gas would be better. I am also in an extreme climate. Summer gets up to 30 deg C (86 deg F for you Americans), and winter gets down to -40 deg C (-40 deg F). Thanks again everybody. I still have lot to learn, and I intend to have fun while doing it!
	0

07-04-2018, 01:50 AM	#2
Douglass Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 375	It seems silly to ask, but did you verify it did not run out of gas? Did the choke get stuck, or switched on? Did the fuel valve get shut off? If these are all good, and if it were me I would start checking wire connections, verify you have spark, make sure fuel is flowing into the carb as a starting point. Also make sure the kill switch is in the run position. The ATV will crank even if the kill switch is in the off position, it just won't fire up.
	1

07-04-2018, 07:45 AM	#3
Al Join Date: Jun 2017 Posts: 73	Tall grass may have ripping a wire connection. They are crappy connections.
	0

07-04-2018, 12:26 PM	#4
sarcopenia Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 4	Thanks for those replies. I actually did not verify the gas level, but I did fill up the whole tank (4.2 L) before going out, and I think these quads are good for like 80 MPG, so I would be shocked if we used all of the fuel. Still, worth checking. I am unaware of an actual choke on/off valve on that model of quad. There is an "adjustment screw" that is supposed to affect the idle rate, but I don't know about an actual choke valve other than that. I will check the fuel valve again, just in case. I will also look for loose connections wrt the kill switch... Thanks again. I'll try and post back if I figure out what the problem was!
	0

07-04-2018, 01:05 PM	#5
ben2go Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 1,335	I have heard of people filling the tank on a new ATV only to later have problems with running. Some of them found their carbs to be filled with gunk. I think it's either a tank rust inhibitor or the tanks were full of gunk from being made. If you have a fuel filter, check it, if not install one, and make sure it's rated for gravity flow. Any small engine shop should have one for a few dollars.
	0

07-04-2018, 03:23 PM	#7
sarcopenia Join Date: Jun 2018 Posts: 4	That part about "gunk in the fuel tank" and the carburetor is a bit unsettling. I hope that isn't the problem. Not sure I am capable of installing after market parts onto this. I guess I could try to take the carburetor apart and clean it or something though. Hmm. Well, I'm going tomorrow to check it out. If not, I'll have to get it to the dealer somehow. It's going to be a b!t$h to load onto my truck just using brute force though....
	0

07-05-2018, 07:07 AM	#9
Paul2 Join Date: Jun 2017 Posts: 81	Hate to say this, I purchased 2 150bulls, same issue with one of them, then I did the new plug n oil n played with the carb per dealers suggestions, result?: The dealer sent me out a new carb and in 2 days, $15 he paid for, I immediately drained the fuel as I had ETHANOL 93 high test mobil gas, and switched to ethanol free from an airbase near me, then installed carb, wasn't too bad, and magically NEVER had another issue. Again, mine did the same thing! so either clean the carb (by drilling out the screws on the bowl, and blah blah blah) OR call them and get a new one, install and change ALL the fuel and never go back to an ethanol mix. In the northeast for some reason the fuel and liberals are brutal and immediately ruin everything. Hope it works out,, I felt your pain.
	0

07-06-2018, 12:41 AM	#13
Hellkitty Join Date: Dec 2017 Posts: 216	Did you buy it from a dealer that put in the break in oil or is it the oil the atv was shipped with? I wouldn't even run it with the shipping oil. I would change it immediately.
	0

07-06-2018, 10:08 AM	#14
Douglass Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Bay Area, CA Posts: 375	x2 - change the oil before you run it again. If you have an owners manual, you can check to see what grade of oil to use with the current temp. I run the 15w40 rotella t4 in all my units. You should be fine running 10w40 to 15w40 oil in your 65-95 deg. F months. I'll check a couple of manuals when I get home to see if it lists grade recommendations based on temp. On all five of my bikes it says to use 91-93 octane on the emissions label, and I think it also lists it in the manual. The highest grade of fuel I can get from the pump is 91. I have been using 91 in all of them, and they all run good and strong.
	0