Well....It seems another Dual Sport found its way to me
 

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...4/Xl%20185.jpg

Only pic i have at the moment. But i am in the process of trading an old project truck of mine for it. Kind of realized the truck was just gonna continue sitting and with increased pressure to downsize on the 4 wheeled side of things it ended up with me looking at this as a trade for it. It is a 1980 or 81. Not exactly sure on year as the kid who wants the truck thinks its an '80 but the pics i have compared it to point to it being a bit newer. Honda XL185S Dual sport. Most of the lighting has been removed at some point in the bikes life but it is not hard to find replacement parts, It is a 6 volt bike so i will more then likely opt for a small SLA battery for it to get the lighting working. Biggest things it needs are a rear tire, tube, chain and sprocket. Other then that the lights replaced as well as a new handle bar and ignition switch. Will not be doing much with it till after the wedding of course but i am looking forward to working on it none the less.

The plan so far:

The same MSR CR mid bend handle bar as my Yamaha DT250
Possibly the same mirrors as well..may do something different on that side of things.

1980 ,and that is honestly a fantastic bike .

I guess I should add or at least ask ,what is your truck ,what is it worth today ,that bike doesn't have any value over about $500.00 as it sits ,but it is a wonderful machine .

One of the best trail bikes ever, and that one will clean up nicely. Enjoy!

Whats the bike in the foreground on the right?

Said truck is a 1994 GMC Sierra K1500 with a 6.5 Diesel. With some major fueling issues. It has sat for the past 4 years and i realized im not doing much with it.

Should be a fun bike. As for what was the other bike it is a 1982 Honda CB750 custom. Or whats left of one anyway...it had bent forks and a bent wheel along with other crash damage. Ironically when i went to this guys place that was the bike i was going to look at. But out of all the stuff he had to offer the XL was the only thing i seen that would be worth it.

That is the holy grail of small dual sport bikes to me; I've been on the hunt for one for a long time.


The frame is what most of the modern Honda clones are patterned after, which means that most of the parts will bolt on. If you wanted a bike with increased suspension travel, you could install the inverted forks and monoshock swingarm from a Lifan (or similar), along with a 223cc engine, replete with electric start. I know the Honda has a certain charm the way it is, but I can't resist tweaking stuff.


The only necessary fab work is to chop the monoshock upper and lower mounts, and weld them onto the Honda frame. I've already mocked up a bike like that, using a similar XR200 frame. If Honda made an XL200 back then, they were rare. I've never seen one.

I am def looking forward to building this bike up. So...by swapping on inverted forks from a hondoid (think thats what you guys call the clones) i would also gain a front disk brake would i not? I am fine with leaving the rear end twin shock and running better shocks on it. Sort of like the old desert racing bikes they used to build out of these XLs. Better forks and brakes up front. But still classic in looks at the same time.

Yes, you'd get disc brakes up front. Depending on the model of China bike, you could have disc brakes on the rear as well.


I recommend against swapping the forks without doing the monoshock conversion. The inverted forks are considerably longer that the stockers, and you'd have a chopper-like effect. The monoshock rear and inverted forks are a matched set that provide tons of ground clearance (comparatively).


With some light fab work, you could also swap the plastic tank and contoured seat from the China bike. Essentially, you'll be able to street-register a China bike, due the Honda frame.


The plan I have is to use a later model XR200 seat and tank, so there is a little more Honda, and a better fuel cap. I have everything in place, except the XL185 frame.

I would be a little careful doing this ,as depending on your doner bike some of the chineese bikes have trash suspension components that are not any better than the original bike in reality .

You're exactly right, Bruce; I should have made similar comments.


I used a Gio as a donor, due to the excellent front forks and the CG223. I also used the swingarm and shock from a Roketa, since it is in good shape, and I won't be needing it. The Roketa shock link is quite sturdy, although the bolt holes are sloppy. I intend to bush the holes, as I did with another project some years ago. The point to all of this for me is a higher seat and improved ground clearance, along with a disc brake upgrade.


The Fat Cat motor you mentioned in another thread would be the icing on the cake!

Hmmm ok Good points about the suspension. I may just go down the route of tuning the existing one then and setting up the brakes similar to how i have them on my DT. One thing i am going to do however is see about fitting some stiffer rear shocks and more then likely add a pvc pipe spacer in the forks to add some preload to them.

Once again good points. I am probably better off working with the stock honda suspension.

I may also see if there are some Honda street bikes that use a compatible front end to gain disk brakes up front. I know with my DT i can swap on an XS 650 front end to do so. I loose an inch or so of height in the front by doing so but can regain it by running a pair of XT500 rear shocks to make the bike sit similar to current dual sports/supermotos. Kinda wondering if there is some parts switching i can do with honda parts to get there as well.

I have an extra gio 250 chassis if you want the front end it is available .I also have a set of Suzuki pe250 rear shocks and the aluminum swing arm and rear wheel complete if that interests you .
Weld ,I have a fat cat I need to assemble one day ,there is a guy about an hour from me that has a spare engine for $50.00 ,next time I am in his area I will pick it up if he still has it .
Bruce.

Oh yes, they did indeed. I had a very nice '83 XL200R a few years back.

http://i401.photobucket.com/albums/p.../Copyof001.jpg


If I'd have know then about the interchangability of the CG250 motors, I would have never gotten rid of it! Wish I had it now, I'd have a nice Zongshen 250 with it's e-start and 12-volts in it in a heartbeat!

For a few years (84 and 85), Honda also made an XR200R which included the 4-valve RFVC head and the dual-carb set-up. It wasn't a great hit, using much more complexity than a 200cc playbike demanded, and it went away.

I will def keep that in mind, Especially the shocks! Not sure how difficult it would be to swap on the swing arm from the Suzuki though.

From the brief reading i have done so far on the XLs apparently it is easy to swap to 12 volt...more or less the same process as on old cars. changing the bulbs and regulator to be 12 volt compatible. If it is literally that easy on this bike i am seriously going to consider it. Makes it a lot easier to get replacement parts to put the lighting back together.

Formal way
Some 12V staor coil works if the hole distance/ height are similar... Rewind the stock also not that difficult...
Quick solution [old stator coil may not handle extra heat]
[1]Reg/rec https://item.taobao.com/item.htm?id=39272228687 for AC headlight (half-wave/ center-tap) system http://mastercircuits.blogspot.com/2...onversion.html
[2]Once had reliable DC, we can fit lights...
Wide voltage DC6-80v https://detail.tmall.com/item.htm?id=45801004864 is a good thingy...
===
Horn still works under 12v system but changing isn't that difficult either

Ok if i am understanding all the above correctly, i would take a R/R like what was in the first link, Do some soldering to the bikes stator or donor stator like in the second link to essentially convert my headlight to being DC powered instead of AC powered? The way the Honda is wired now is that the Headlight and Brake light are AC powered while the tail light and signals are DC powered off of the battery. I know some aftermarket headlight assemblies use replaceable bulbs of the H3 and H4 type that i can simply replace with a 6 volt H3 or H4 bulb. However by converting to 12V i can also look at the idea of running a low wattage LED aux light.

Darkrider... I hope you get on with restoration sooner rather than later. I love seeing these classics reborn! With an endorsement like that from weldandgrind, you know you found something special ;)

Once my wallet recovers from the wedding in July, It will be full steam ahead on getting the XL on the road. It and my DT250. The DT needs a carb job and a new battery. Going to try an emergency light SLA battery on the DT and if it works out most likely use one on the XL as well to keep it 6 volt. I lean more towards the idea of keeping it as it was at least on the headlight side for now. I may end up seeing what is easier to find parts wise for the signal lights. I have seen some guys fit aftermarket lights from dual sport kits and just change the bulbs for 6 volt versions.

Was that 1976 Yamaha DT250C dual sportbike called a duel sport back then. Does anyone know when the term duel sport was first marketed?

The Yamaha was marketed as an Enduro. Not sure when the DS term popped up though.

Wiring diagram http://pan.baidu.com/s/1dFdkQ5r

nice XL. i converted my 1979 model to 12 volt in four easy steps: put 12 volt globes in all the lights, got H4 headlight and hook it up, replaced the flasher with a 12 volt flasher and added a 12 volt battery. that was it. no need to upgrade the stator or the rectifier. not kidding!

I had heard it was that simple on these bikes. Nice to know that it is confirmed! I believe i read somewhere that the XL and XRs Stator put out plenty enough juice to run 12 V as is. What i may do to get a bit more umph out of the headlight is wire the AC lead to be the switched lead on a relay then that way the H4 pulls power straight from the battery when it is on. I am assuming you simply went from the 35 W 6 volt H4 to a 35 watt 12 volt H4?

i m running LED tail and indicators now, but had the normal setup converted to 12 V before - and a large round H4 metal headlight with a 55/60 narva plus filament. the original headlight is 7 inch i think, i got an 8 inch (i think) from the wrecker's. nice to keep it looking historical. as far as my bike goes, this worked well, did 10 000 km with that setup before going LED with the new zong motor.

Nice! Wonder if the original electronics would support LED lights for less power draw?

Test w/ "Dummy load" b4 order the LED...

the wiring will be okay, but 6 Volt LED? is that going to work with resistors and the original flasher? or will the 6V system drive the 12 Volt LED flasher?
in any event, don t bother with 6 volt, upgrading to 12 is easy and you need next to no skills, only globes, flasher and battery! 6 volt lights will be kinda dim in the daytime.

Nice, Like i said i may end up trying to wire in a relay to take the headlight load from the wiring. even if its just for safety sake. Use the original headlight wiring to trigger the relay.

Got the bike home tonight, Initial look over of it tells me i will need to get some parts for the rear brakes as well as the rear wheel adjusters. I am thinking i may look at getting a newer style H4 headlight with number plate to go with the newer super moto style fender that came with it.

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...size_distr.jpg

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c2...size_distr.jpg

Check out that giant humongous tail light :hehe: you could certainly see that from behind back in the day

That is one thing i like about the older bikes. Their lighting is usually a lot larger and a lot easier to see.

So...made a decision when it comes to this bike. The plan is i will most likely end up replacing the stock headlight with a larger 7" one off of a Honda CB or similar model. This will allow me to keep the classic look but gain a bit more light output due to both the larger light and the fact it uses an H4 bulb. As suggested in the earlier part of this thread i will also end up experimenting with 12 volt bulbs to see what the bike likes in terms of wattage. More then likely may try to find stock signal lights for it or find some decent aftermarket replacements and run 12 volt bulbs in them. If it does not work out as things like this vary from bike to bike of course i can always keep it 6 volt and run a 6 volt H4 bulb in the new headlight.

Priced out the following parts for the bike as well:

DID 428 chain 120 link (stock length)
JT sprockets (stock replacements)
Shinko K702 tires (i recall looking at these for the DT as well)

All in all the parts above will be just under $400

Still need to locate the parts to rebuild the rear brake...will need the pedal, and the linkage to connect it.

Parts i am considering to upgrade the bike further:

Protaper SE ATV handlebar
adapting some sort of aftermarket muffler
small pelican or similar case bolted to the rear rack for tools.
same ken sean bar end mirrors as used on the DT
Clarke fuel tank.

Ok just a bit of an update. Bike got put into storage along with the DT250 and Interceptor during the move. But i will be working on gathering the parts i need for it during the winter. The thing that is slowing me up a bit is finding a 12 volt battery that will fit in the stock location. May need to get a bit creative with this. One thing i have kicked around a couple times with both the DT250 and this bike is mounting a 50 cal ammo can on the left side of the bike to serve as a tool box/saddle case...Might even run two on both bikes along with the aforementioned pelican case on the rear rack. If i do end up going this route it will make it a TON easier to fit a large capacity 12 volt AGM type battery as i would simply move it from the stock location to the right side case. The ammo box is metal so that should provide plenty of heat shielding from the exhaust. But then again i do have the option of adding a bit of insulation between the battery and that side of the case..I should probably add insulation around the entire battery to prevent shorts anyway. Sure it adds a mild amount of weight but having the brighter lights as a result of the 12 V conversion makes it worth it. Having the other cases to carry tools and other required items will make it easy to maintain the bike in the field. As both this bike and the DT250 will see some time loaded in the back of a future expedition vehicle build being able to fix them in the field is important.

Japanese idea:http://blogs.yahoo.co.jp/puchansdr/34209953.html That 12v battery is 81mm*71mm*106mm (Stock: 71*71*96) . Check out the shop u bought the 6v SLA for DT250, some 12V 2.?Ah may jammed in...
Ultra ghetto idea:lmao:, isn't it? http://kappanda.blog.so-net.ne.jp/archive/c2301453137-1 ( - to |) | http://kattsu00.blog.fc2.com/blog-entry-1645.html (Ni-cd pack)

Can you tell us the battery box dimensions? Do you have a pic?

Not off hand, The bike is still loaded up in the bed of my Chevy out at my buddies place. At first glance it looks like it isnt much bigger then that SLA 6V you suggested for the DT250...Let me see if i can find a replacement battery for that model online to see what it says it should be.

Heres one that lists the bike on Ebay and from what i remember from looking at the bike...it looks to be the correct size. In fact you can kind of see the battery peeking out from behind the right side cover in the pics of the bike that i posted earlier


http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-6N4-2A-4...-/171501353744

Specs

Voltage: 6
Length: 2.8"
Width: 2.8"
Height: 3.8"
Weight: 1.3 lbs
Capacity: 4 Ah


It lists it as fitting the DT250 as well. As said in this pic you can see the battery behind the cover.

Wait...hold up...from what i gathered of that they rigged in a battery pack from an RC? Hmmm....

After some thought...i may pull the seat off of the bike and take a look at my options there...i wonder if i couldn't do something similar to what Spud did with his XR and tuck a compact gel cell battery under there somewhere. Antigravity makes a nice compact 4 cell battery that may do the trick. They also make a couple 6 volt batteries that may work if i figure out a new way of mounting the battery on the bike as even the smaller one of the two is bigger then the stock one.


Edit: Ok after looking at that link Humanbeing posted up with the Nicad set up...I see a couple possible options here....As long as the XL185 chassis is set up like the 125 in the link i can do exactly like Spud did and lay the battery on top of the air box...or run a pod filter and replace the air box with a custom airbox/battery box. one thing i love about AGMs..they can be laid down at any angle and work properly. Sure they cost a bit more but its worth it for the ability to do things like that... Doing this gets the battery away from the rear tire and in a much better protected position.

So there is a chance i may end up trading this bike off as a payment towards a truck. But i am unsure at this time. Already asked Spud his thoughts on keeping the knobbies on it for street use to save a bit of coin that i could put towards the other problems with the bike. Time will tell which way i end up going with it.

Ok...Disregarding the above post for a moment...I seen mention of fitting later engines into these bikes earlier in the thread...My question is this...would a motor from say one of the new TT250s be similar enough to be possibly fitted into this chassis? Or at least an engine from say a Gio dirtbike? More curious about how similar the CG engine is to the XL engine.